3.9 heads

Sozialkampf

Sozialkampf

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Has anyone had any serious head porting performed on their heads? I can't seem to find any specs, but what are the valve sizes and combustion CC's? I might as well ask about cam lift and duration. If anyone knows, or can point me in the right direction,thanks.
 
with out a few other mods and reprograms, i Cant see it making it worth the effort. there are bolt on's that would get you more power with out having to pull your motor apart. Programmers, CIA's, Coils,Plugs,I could go on and on, a good port job will cost as much as most of these combined and still might not gain you what these could. Just my opinion, I might be wrong about it but sure makes sense to go upon this the easiier way. Its not a 500hp beast and by porting and polishing its not going to get any closer. Keep it simple.
 
I hear you. I'm a machinist/mechanic/fabricator by trade and my LSE is a project car. The car was a repo special and I have already removed the engine. I've wanted to build up one of these for awhile. With the small displacement it'll take more rev's to make the power and there is always room for improvement. I wasn't sure if someone on this site has had any experience with these heads or not. I'll get a couple LS guinea pig heads and see how much can be contoured before breaking into a water jacket. Plus before and after flow numbers.
 
Most you might see is around 10 or 15HP but I've seen Header jobs for 2500-5000 dollars...not worth the 10-15HP

So I've been told by other members. Better off with technical mods or doing the Cats/Exhaust
 
i can see your experimental view of the whole deal by just couldnt really want to go to that extream just for 10 or 20 hp. Dont quote this but I though I remeber hearing the jackets are real tight to the ports but Im not sure if that is correct. (heard about all FOMOCO 4V Heads. ) Unsure if thats true or not
 
It'll be in the name of experimentation and hobby.:) No specs though?
 
Srry, someone might if they bored to, sure someone will answer the post. But i'm not gonna do headers for just a 3.9L......Bigger engine yes..but not a teenie weenie Mini-Jag engine....
 
sorry man not really ever found that in my studies. I respect your hobby expieriment. Let me know how it goes for ya, sounds interesting
 
Head Re-work

Quik LS has done a head clean-up and reported that he found just less than 30 HP by doing so. He said at one time that he'd give us a write-up but he's been very busy. For my project, I've arranged to have my heads Extrude-Honed. I haven't sent them in yet---been busy. You might check 'Land Speed LS' in the high performance section. :) Now we'll sit back and hear from the peanut gallery!:D
KS
 
There is also a member from VA that has a custom ground cam, I can't remember his user name for the life of me.
 
jolinc01 said:
There is also a member from VA that has a custom ground cam, I can't remember his user name for the life of me.
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umm EpmireLS had the custom ground cams... he was from TX IIRC
Just to clarify, a DOHC V shaped motor has 4 cams Dual Over Head Cam. Means two of them at the top of the heads. V shaped motors (V6 or V8) have two heads. So two cams times two heads... Four cams.


yeah I've thought about doing these heads a few times... the bottom line I keep running into is the fact that these are ford 4v's... they are pretty similar to the terminator heads, and they flow like a dream! There has been other custom machining discussed that would be easier and more of w worth while task imho. A custom fabbed intake mani could be nice. Just be careful with it, the long runners is where we get any kind of low end grunt from. Cams have been done, and I think he saw decent improvements but not what he wanted to. Maybe do some pulleys, but i honestly think pulleys are a waste of time unless your blown.

Either way man, glad to see someone willing to put in the work to get something special from their LS.
 
Yep - as Ken stated - I did a set of head a few years back (before I was very active on the boards) - it was 22rwhp gain (can't remember the torque number). I still have the heads on the floor.... I did promise Ken some pics - I'm in the garage all weekend (carbon fiber'ing the dash on my Lotus) so I should be able to take some pics waiting for resin to dry....

Another member of the LLSOC did them as well, ended up cutting into the water jacket...

Swapping the head whiile they are in the car = no fun.
 
bgr said:
where can you get the pullies from?
Click to expand...

I would forget the pulleys - especially on Gen1. The alternator is barely able to keep up as it is, and slowing the fan pump is not a great idea.

You may be able to pick up a little by going to an electric fan and water pump (and then upgrading the alternator).
 
Good luck with the experimenting! No offense, but some of the advice on here is exactly why there's no real support for these cars. "Just do the same 3 bolt-ons as every other member and blah blah blah." It's almost a given that he's going to do the bolt-ons to compliment the head work. I don't recall him saying "this will be my only mod." The motor is torn down, why not start from the ground up?
And Petessweets, wtf are you talking about headers for? He asked about head work, and for specifics of the LS' heads and cams.
I may be able to get some of these specs, but it'll probably take a few days. I'll update this thread if/when I get the info you're looking for. Keep us posted with your project, I for one would be interested in seeing something that hasn't been talked about 13 times this week. :cool:

Mark
 
Quik LS said:
I would forget the pulleys - especially on Gen1. The alternator is barely able to keep up as it is, and slowing the fan pump is not a great idea.

You may be able to pick up a little by going to an electric fan and water pump (and then upgrading the alternator).
Click to expand...

I agree with pulleys being a waste!

I cant see doing these heads unless you were going for MONSTROUS numbers. I wouldn't be surprised to see these heads support 700+ hp before they get too restrictive. I've looked at them countless times for my TT build... its just not worth it. I've even looked at just rebuilding them for longevity's sake. I still don't think its worth it. These motors are a higher mileage motor with some really nice parts. The heads are FAR from the weakest link in the power chain. I have pretty well sold myself on cams, but even still. Quick said it best when I was looking at rebuilding my heads. These aren't like on hot rod TV where you swap a cam in a sat morning. They are going to be one hell of a PITA! Where you already have the motor out and apart, now would be the time to cams. I think you can expect about 1200-1500 for all four. I don't have exact prices for mine, but that's the ball park I'm getting from places. I wold look heavily into where you want to go with the car before camming though. I'm sure I don't have to tell you that FI cams aren't the same as NA. Another option if you do CNC machining, would be to make a good set of rods and pistons. I don't know what your skill level or access to stuff is, but that would be an interesting modification. I know I want a set of rods and pistons so I can start cranking up the boost.

There are a few really good threads to read in here. Land Speed is awesome and covers tons of different aspects. Supercharger thread and Turbo thread both cover some good forced induction stuff. There is a thread for 8.8 swaps which introduce a whole new world of possibilities with the drive train. My build thread (that I've been slacking on big time) for the 6spd TT Nitro LS has some more fabrication in it as well.
 
01LSVT said:
Good luck with the experimenting! No offense, but some of the advice on here is exactly why there's no real support for these cars. "Just do the same 3 bolt-ons as every other member and blah blah blah." It's almost a given that he's going to do the bolt-ons to compliment the head work. I don't recall him saying "this will be my only mod." The motor is torn down, why not start from the ground up?
And Petessweets, wtf are you talking about headers for? He asked about head work, and for specifics of the LS' heads and cams.
I may be able to get some of these specs, but it'll probably take a few days. I'll update this thread if/when I get the info you're looking for. Keep us posted with your project, I for one would be interested in seeing something that hasn't been talked about 13 times this week. :cool:

Mark
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When I hear "heads" I translate that to headers since I've had a handful of people tell me to do that for my car......but I just give them the finger when I show them the cost for the work.
 
well... without being a dick to you, go read the threads I mentioned earlier in this one and see what you can learn. post 18
 
01LSVT said:
Good luck with the experimenting! No offense, but some of the advice on here is exactly why there's no real support for these cars. "Just do the same 3 bolt-ons as every other member and blah blah blah." It's almost a given that he's going to do the bolt-ons to compliment the head work. I don't recall him saying "this will be my only mod." The motor is torn down, why not start from the ground up?
And Petessweets, wtf are you talking about headers for? He asked about head work, and for specifics of the LS' heads and cams.
I may be able to get some of these specs, but it'll probably take a few days. I'll update this thread if/when I get the info you're looking for. Keep us posted with your project, I for one would be interested in seeing something that hasn't been talked about 13 times this week. :cool:

Mark
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I tend to agree with Mark here. I know you guys have asked if I thought porting the 4v heads on these cars was worth it and I have usually said no. The BIG thing you have to remember is that was taken in the context of already having forced induction or planning to get FI after doing the heads. If you have FI then these heads will support allot of power before becoming any sort of appreciable bottleneck. In that case the money and time is probably better put elsewhere. However, the game changes immensely when you plan to stay N/A. While these heads flow pretty well there are always gains to be made. Normally I would not recommend it but if this guy does machining for a living, has an LS with its engine already out, and wants to do the project then why the hell not? I say go for it.






PetesSweets86 said:
Most you might see is around 10 or 15HP but I've seen Header jobs for 2500-5000 dollars...not worth the 10-15HP

So I've been told by other members. Better off with technical mods or doing the Cats/Exhaust
Click to expand...


Pete I don't mean to sound like a jerk here but you have been on this forum a total of about two minutes, and based upon your previous posts, it seems that you do not know much about modding vehicles. I would stay away from giving tech information, especially solid numbers, until you know quite a bit more and/or have performed your own in-depth testing. I don't mean to rain on your parade here but I cannot stand it when newbies read one or two tech threads and then assume they know it all. You have done that crap before in at least one other thread too. Unless you know this stuff and do your own testing then stop posting hard numbers about it that may have been taken out of original context.
 
01LSVT said:
Good luck with the experimenting!
I may be able to get some of these specs, but it'll probably take a few days. I'll update this thread if/when I get the info you're looking for. Keep us posted with your project, I for one would be interested in seeing something that hasn't been talked about 13 times this week. :cool:
Click to expand...

Thanks buddy! I'll be looking around too. If anything, once the heads are off I can measure the valves.
I'll note that this car is 1 of 5 project cars and not my everyday driver. The car will still be N/A and is not going to be crazy or anything just a project for my own curiosity really.

I know the valve area is alot more than a 2 valve engine so I agree that the effienciency is tough to improve on. I worked over a set of GT-40X heads and I was happy to see how well a 5 angle valve job can improve CFM but more intrigued to see that a reverse angle cut on the exhaust valves can pick up an apprecitable amount also, like 9 or 10 cfm @ .580 lift. Of course were talking inline SBF heads that flow as well as my water faucet. Totally different animal:D I wonder how well this would work on 4V heads, never really messed with them. If you guys have any advice or experience I'd love to hear it. Plus thanks all, love the site and the cars! I'll keep you posted.
 
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