Democrats speaking of impeachment, hurting chances of election win

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Dems split as impeachment whispers get louder

Some see anti-Bush movement as distracting from key issues, boosting GOP
By Michael Powell
The Washington Post
Updated: 4:06 a.m. ET March 25, 2006

HOLYOKE, Mass. - To drive through the mill towns and curling country roads here is to journey into New England's impeachment belt. Three of this state's 10 House members have called for the investigation and possible impeachment of President Bush.

Thirty miles north, residents in four Vermont villages voted earlier this month at annual town meetings to buy more rock salt, approve school budgets and impeach the president for lying about Iraq having weapons of mass destruction and for sanctioning torture.

Window cleaner Ira Clemons put down his squeegee in the lobby of a city mall and stroked his goatee as he considered the question: Would you support your congressman's call to impeach Bush? His smile grew until it looked like a three-quarters moon.

"Why not? The man's been lying from Jump Street on the war in Iraq," Clemons said. "Bush says there were weapons of mass destruction, but there wasn't. Says we had enough soldiers, but we didn't. Says it's not a civil war -- but it is." He added: "I was really upset about 9/11 -- so don't lie to me."

Anger years in the making
It would be a considerable overstatement to say the fledgling impeachment movement threatens to topple a presidency -- there are just 33 House co-sponsors of a motion by Rep. John Conyers Jr. (D-Mich.) to investigate and perhaps impeach Bush, and a large majority of elected Democrats think it is a bad idea. But talk bubbles up in many corners of the nation, and on the Internet, where several Web sites have led the charge, giving liberals an outlet for anger that has been years in the making.

"The value of a powerful idea, like impeachment of the president for criminal acts, is that it has a long shelf life and opens a debate," said Bill Goodman of the Center for Constitutional Rights, which represents Guantanamo Bay detainees.

The San Francisco Board of Supervisors voted last month to urge Congress to impeach Bush, as have state Democratic parties, including those of New Mexico, Nevada, North Carolina and Wisconsin. A Zogby International poll showed that 51 percent of respondents agreed that Bush should be impeached if he lied about Iraq, a far greater percentage than believed President Bill Clinton should be impeached during the Monica S. Lewinsky scandal.

And Harper's Magazine this month ran a cover piece titled "The Case for Impeachment: Why We Can No Longer Afford George W. Bush."

"If the president says 'We made mistakes,' fine, let's move on," said Rep. Michael E. Capuano (D-Mass.). "But if he lied to get America into a war, I can't imagine anything more impeachable."

No unity among Democrats
Democrats remain far from unified. Prominent party leaders -- and a large majority of those in Congress -- distance themselves from the effort. They say the very word is a distraction, that talk of impeachment and censure reflect the polarization of politics. Activists spend too many hours dialing Democratic politicians and angrily demanding impeachment votes, they say.

In California, poet Kevin Hearle, an impeachment supporter, is challenging liberal Rep. Tom Lantos -- who opposes impeachment -- in the Democratic primary in June.

"Impeachment is an outlet for anger and frustration, which I share, but politics ain't therapy," said Rep. Barney Frank, a Massachusetts liberal who declined to sign the Conyers resolution. "Bush would much rather debate impeachment than the disastrous war in Iraq."

The GOP establishment has welcomed the threat. It has been a rough patch for the party -- Bush's approval ratings in polls are lower than for any president in recent history. With midterm elections in the offing, Republican leaders view impeachment as kerosene poured on the bonfires of their party base.

"The Democrats' plan for 2006?" Republican National Committee Chairman Ken Mehlman wrote in a fundraising e-mail Thursday. "Take the House and Senate and impeach the president. With our nation at war, is this the kind of Congress you want?"

Iraq at the center of the storm
The argument for an impeachment inquiry -- which draws support from prominent constitutional scholars such as Harvard's Laurence H. Tribe and former Reagan deputy attorney general Bruce Fein -- centers on Bush's conduct before and after the invasion of Iraq in 2003.

It is argued that Bush and his officials conspired to manufacture evidence of weapons of mass destruction to persuade Congress to approve the invasion. Former Treasury secretary Paul H. O'Neill told CBS News's "60 Minutes" that "from the very beginning there was a conviction that Saddam Hussein was a bad person and that he needed to go . . . it was all about finding a way to do it." And a senior British intelligence official wrote in what is now known as the "Downing Street memo" that Bush officials were intent on fixing "the intelligence and the facts . . . around the policy."

Critics point to Bush's approval of harsh interrogations of prisoners captured Iraq and Afghanistan, tactics that human rights groups such as Amnesty International say amount to torture. Bush also authorized warrantless electronic surveillance of telephone calls and e-mails, subjecting possibly thousands of Americans each year to eavesdropping since 2001.

"Bush is saying 'I'm the president' and, on a range of issues -- from war to torture to illegal surveillance -- 'I can do as I like,' " said Michael Ratner of the Center for Constitutional Rights. "This administration needs to be slapped down and held accountable for actions that could change the shape of our democracy."

Tribe wrote Conyers, dismissing Bush's defense of warrantless surveillance as "poppycock." It constituted, Tribe concluded, "as grave an abuse of executive authority as I can recall ever having studied."

But posed against this bill of aggrievement are legal and practical realities. Not all scholars, even of a liberal bent, agree that Bush has committed "high crimes and misdemeanors." Bush's legal advice may be wrong, they say, but still reside within the bounds of reason.

"The Clinton impeachment was plainly unconstitutional, and a Bush impeachment would be nearly as bad," said Cass R. Sunstein, a professor of constitutional law at the University of Chicago. "There is a very good argument that the president had it wrong on WMD in Iraq but that he was acting in complete good faith."

Sunstein argues that Bush's decision to conduct surveillance of Americans without court approval flowed from Congress's vote to allow an armed struggle against al-Qaeda. "If you can kill them, why can't you spy on them?" Sunstein said, adding that this is a minority view.

Here in Massachusetts and Vermont, though, in the back roads and on the streets of Holyoke and Springfield, the discontent with Bush is palpable. These are states that, per capita, have sent disproportionate numbers of soldiers to Iraq. Many in these middle- and working-class towns are not pleased that so many friends and cousins are coming back wounded or dead.

"He picks and chooses his information and can't admit it's erroneous, and he annoys me," said Colleen Kucinski, walking Aleks, 5, and Gregory, 2, home.

Would she support impeachment? Kucinski wags her head "yes" before the question is finished. "Without a doubt. This is far more serious than Clinton and Monica. This is about life and death. We're fighting a war on his say-so and it was all wrong.

© 2006 The Washington Post Company
© 2006 MSNBC.com

URL: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12003304/
 
It is my opinion that Feingold is the most dangerous man in America right now. Can he win the nomination as a far left-winger? Maybe. He will be the favorite in the early primaries.

Better start taking a look at this guy's track record. If he gets in the White House, he'll sell us out to the U.N. and we will be thrown into World War III and he tries to 'talk' his way out of the upcoming fight against the facist bullies. What always happens to the wimp. He gets his can kicked.

At least I'm on the record.
 
Meanwhile the GOP rips itself apart at the seams.......

Immigrant issue rips GOP unity
Lugar derides as ‘zealots’ those favoring deportations

By Sylvia A. Smith
Washington editor

WASHINGTON – A wall along the Mexican border is in competition with the reality of American factories and farms, and Republicans in Congress are on the brink of battle over two sharply differing approaches to immigration.

The Senate is scheduled to begin debating this week, but Sen. Richard Lugar, R-Ind., questions whether any bill will end up on President Bush’s desk because the Senate is unlikely to go along with the approach adopted by “zealots” in the House last year.

“A good number of people there wanted a (campaign) issue and wanted to say they had met the issue rather than were serious about facing a huge American dilemma,” he said.

Business and farm groups have said the tough enforcement measures in the House legislation – fines of up to $50,000 for businesses that hire illegal immigrants, for instance – would cause economic chaos.

The issue is being fiercely fought, and the showdown is will expose fault lines in what largely has been a united Republican Congress and Republican White House.

“Inside the Republican Party, it’s substantially the most divisive issue,” said Rep. Mark Souder, R-3rd.

One bloc, almost exclusively Republicans, insists that illegal immigration has to be stopped, and people already in the United States illegally have to be deported before there’s any discussion about the “guest worker” program that Bush has called for since his first term.

Bush, some Republicans and many Democrats say it’s unrealistic to propose deporting the 11 million or more undocumented immigrants and that there should be a way to allow them to work legally for a few years before insisting they return home. Still others want an amnesty program that would allow illegal immigrants to become legal residents and, eventually, citizens.
“Part of enforcing our borders is to have a guest worker program that encourages people to register their presence so that we know who they are and says to them, if you’re doing a job an American won’t do, you’re welcome here for a period of time to do that job,” Bush said Thursday.

The House adopted a bill last year to force employers to check the immigration status of their workers and fine businesses up to $50,000 if they don’t; make “unlawful presence” in the United States a felony; create a 700-mile high-security fence along the Mexican border; and encourage state and city police departments to arrest people for immigration violations.
House leaders said they didn’t want to consider Bush’s guest worker program until after the Senate acted on the House bill.

“I do not believe that you can mesh these things. They are antithetical. You really can not connect guest worker to enforcement,” said Rep. Tom Tancredo, R-Colo., the leader in the House of opposition to Bush’s approach. “If you combine (guest worker) with an enforcement plan, I assure you all you get is the guest worker plan. It takes over everything because the administration is all for that. … All the emphasis will be on the guest worker plan, nothing on the enforcement.”

Lugar is critical of that approach.

“Our zeal to make sure the border is sealed (could) create a very severe economic recession,” he said.

Lugar called the proposal for a fence at the border “simply not good legislation. It does absolutely nothing to solve the problem of however millions of undocumented aliens of all countries who are in our country or the very acute problems which are coming to the fore now in a very big way of farm groups, of business groups.”

Souder, one of 17 Republicans who voted against the House bill last year, derides the proposal to deport all illegal immigrants.

“All the individuals who so piously say that they believe anything that acknowledges that people are here illegally is amnesty admit we can’t even find the drug dealers to throw them out, let alone the 15 to 18 million people,” Souder said. “They have a good sound bite, but – let’s just put it bluntly – they all admit that we can’t deport the people who are here. So, how do they propose to address it? Have them be shadow people the rest of their lives?”

Souder said he supports tougher border restrictions but wants a more realistic immigration policy. He said he voted against the House bill because of the requirements to make employers verify the immigration status of their workers and the deportation provisions.

“Is it better to keep a plant in Indiana with Mexican workers in it or move the whole plant to Mexico? That’s what we’re debating,” he said. Without immigrants, he said, “we’ll have fewer nurses, we’ll have less students at IPFW. The whole place would fall down. We wouldn’t be making it in northeast Indiana without all these immigrants and refugees.”

Although the Senate Judiciary Committee hasn’t developed a bill yet, Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tenn., said he’ll propose his own legislation this week if the committee doesn’t, a prospect that frustrates Lugar, who said the issues are complicated and worthy of at least one committee thrashing them out.

But House members have vowed that a Senate version that includes a guest worker program will be dead on arrival.

“Who is the Senate listening to?” Tancredo said. “They’re certainly not listening to the American public. The message is not mixed coming from America. The message from America – black America, white America, brown America, yellow America … is stop illegal immigration.
“They’re listening to some of their corporate friends, business supporters who say we need the cheap labor and we need movement across the borders that will not be in any way restricted or inhibited because trade will be affected by it,” he said.

If the Republican Party is deadlocked over immigration policy, is Frist’s vow to have a floor debate just political theater?

“A lot of it,” Lugar said. “I’m sad that that’s the case, but it wouldn’t be the first time.”

It was one point Tancredo agrees with.
“It’s good politics for my party,” he said.
 

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