Etc engine fail safe mode

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Marcus101

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So it was terrible slushy snowy weather out on my way home from work and when I began sliding the rpms dropped and the lights dimmed with the error etc engine fail safe mode. The coils were replaced last year...

The check advance trac and the abs light are always on prior to this. The engine light came on Sunday in normal driving conditions and hasn't gone away since.

No misfiring during idling either.

What could the issue be ?
 
Do you still have more or less full throttle response? Some failures of the ABS will cause a particular ETC failsafe mode. Your first step is to find out what the OBDII codes for the ABS are.
 
joegr said:
Do you still have more or less full throttle response? Some failures of the ABS will cause a particular ETC failsafe mode. Your first step is to find out what the OBDII codes for the ABS are.
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Yeah I tried revving the engine on a clear spot of road and it worked just fine. Whenever I lost minor control over the vehicle due to the slippery roads the rpms dropped. I'm going to use my scanner this weekend to get the error codes and I'll post them here. Thanks for the quick response!
 
joegr said:
Do you still have more or less full throttle response? Some failures of the ABS will cause a particular ETC failsafe mode. Your first step is to find out what the OBDII codes for the ABS are.
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To be clear here, your message center said "ETC failsafe"? You can't reset that, but you can dismiss the message. (Turning the car off and back on will reset failsafe mode.)

ETC failsafe occurs when the PCM thinks that it can't control the throttle or when it can't be sure what position you have the gas pedal in. It goes into failsafe mode where power is greatly limited to insure that there is no unintended or uncontrollable acceleration.

What triggers it?

There are three gas pedal position sensors. If they don't all say the same thing (within reason), ETC failsafe is triggered. Note that RF noise from a bad coil might make the PCM read the wrong value for one or more of these sensors.

There is a throttle position sensor. If it says the throttle is in a different position than the PCM wants it to be in, then ETC failsafe is triggered. Again, RF noise from a bad coil can cause a false position reading.

There is the servo motor that moves the throttle. If it can't move the throttle to where the PCM wants it, then ETC failsafe is triggered. Often with the LS, RF noise is the problem. However, maybe this time the throttle really stuck. It's possible that it froze up in the conditions that you were in. Interestingly, there is actually an OBD code for iced over throttle. I wonder if it would come up if you had the codes read?

You said that in a previous post regarding the same error. I think in my case the advance trac being all wonky, activated when I was sliding in the snow locking my gas pedal and reducing my RPMs which probably set off the pedal position sensors triggering the failsafe. Correct me if my theory is wrong though, you're the expert here :) Btw the error is gone once I started up my car again.
 
Well, you did say to correct you if you were wrong.
There are multiple ETC failsafe modes. The worst ones are when the PCM thinks it can't control the throttle or when it isn't sure about the gas pedal position. For that one, it cuts engine power greatly, sometimes completely down to idle. Clearly, that it not the one you are experiencing.

One of the more minor failsafe modes occurs when the PCM can't be sure how fast the car is going. When this happens, the throttle control strategy has to change to a much simpler one than normal. This is also a ECT failsafe mode. The PCM gets all its information about how fast the car is going from the ABS module. Therefore, it seems likely that your ETC failsafe is related to your ABS fault(s).
 
Marcus101 said:
To be clear here ... the error is gone once I started up my car again.
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It always will on start up as the values are once again within the acceptable allowable tolerances.

Check all wheel speed sensors, cables and connectors.
 
So
RigsLS said:
It always will on start up as the values are once again within the acceptable allowable tolerances.

Check all wheel speed sensors, cables and connectors.
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The car is now noticeably misfiring so should i replace all the coils asap or can I wait for awhile ?
 
Marcus101 said:
So

The car is now noticeably misfiring so should i replace all the coils asap or can I wait for awhile ?
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What brand of coils did you use last time? Did you replace the plugs at the same time? Did you verify that the gaps were set to 1.0mm? Are you certain that it is misfire, and not mis-activation of the traction control?
 
joegr said:
What brand of coils did you use last time? Did you replace the plugs at the same time? Did you verify that the gaps were set to 1.0mm? Are you certain that it is misfire, and not mis-activation of the traction control?
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It was my brothers car last year. He purchased coils off eBay not the best brand he says. They were changed in 2014. While idling at a stop light or in park it misfires every few seconds. Plugs were also replaced.
 
Yep, should get Motorcraft coils and new plugs in there before you lose a catalytic converter. (There may be some good aftermarket brands, but I don't know them.)
 
joegr said:
Yep, should get Motorcraft coils and new plugs in there before you lose a catalytic converter. (There may be some good aftermarket brands, but I don't know them.)
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How much you think it would cost to just get a mechanic to do it? Maybe buying the part myself will save me some cash ?
 
DIY should be less than $500, Mechanic could be $600 to $900?
 
04_Sport_LS said:
Maybe... since he hasn't mentioned his year or engine yet!!!
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Well, if it has ECT, then it has to be 2nd gen. That's half the question answered. He linked to a set of eight really cheap aftermarket coils, so that's the other half of the question answered.
 
FYI... I can recommend some aftermarket coils. Borg Warner E418 found at O'reillys,,,, and Standard Motor Products FD506 from Rock Auto. Both are the same part with a different "branding" With 100k miles on mine,,, I definitely wouldn't call them crappy... and last I checked they are still made in the USA. Motorcrafts are going to come from Mexico, (even if it is a tier 1 supplier).

From the looks of it... the DG515 coils might/maybe be old stock,,, and replaced by the DG529, (which is more expensive).

Either way... $100 for 8 plugs and coils seems a bit suspect. Especially when the good aftermarket coils cost close to as much as the factory coils.
Sure... the seller has Motorcraft pasted all over the add,,, and the plugs are Motorcraft... but I doubt the coils are.

AH Ha!!! From the ebay add:

""Part Brand: AFTERMARKET COIL, MOTORCRAFT SPARK PLUG""

Here's the same seller... selling "true" motorcraft coils. BIG difference in price.

set of 8 Motorcraft Ignition Coil DG515 DG529 FD506 Lincoln LS Ford Thunderbird | eBay
 
04_Sport_LS said:
FYI... I can recommend some aftermarket coils. Borg Warner E418 found at O'reillys,,,, and Standard Motor Products FD506 from Rock Auto. Both are the same part with a different "branding" With 100k miles on mine,,, I definitely wouldn't call them crappy... and last I checked they are still made in the USA. Motorcrafts are going to come from Mexico, (even if it is a tier 1 supplier).

From the looks of it... the DG515 coils might/maybe be old stock,,, and replaced by the DG529, (which is more expensive).

Either way... $100 for 8 plugs and coils seems a bit suspect. Especially when the good aftermarket coils cost close to as much as the factory coils.
Sure... the seller has Motorcraft pasted all over the add,,, and the plugs are Motorcraft... but I doubt the coils are.

AH Ha!!! From the ebay add:

""Part Brand: AFTERMARKET COIL, MOTORCRAFT SPARK PLUG""

Here's the same seller... selling "true" motorcraft coils. BIG difference in price.

set of 8 Motorcraft Ignition Coil DG515 DG529 FD506 Lincoln LS Ford Thunderbird | eBay
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Oh I see, and Im not messing around lol. I have a 2005 Lincolns LSE Sport V8, 190k on it.

If the coils are that expensive, I might as well do it all through my mechanic since I'm not too familiar with DIY projects on cars yet. As for the current state of the car; drove 100 km/h on the highway with no drops in RPM's (still noticeably misfiring when idling though) Also, my ABS system randomly kicked in when I was driving very slowly in a parking lot whenever I lightly pressed down on the brakes. (ABS light and check advance trac lights still on btw.) Going to get the sensors changed Friday and get a quote on the aftermarket coils you recommended.
 
Had ETC failsafe when coil #4 was on its way out.

Have had Delphi coils off Rockauto for $28 a piece for the past year still running strong. Something to note the springs are much better then the OEM ones.
 
nghtshd88 said:
Had ETC failsafe when coil #4 was on its way out.

Have had Delphi coils off Rockauto for $28 a piece for the past year still running strong. Something to note the springs are much better then the OEM ones.
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Ill look into coil #4 this weekend, thanks!
 
Marcus101 said:
Ill look into coil #4 this weekend, thanks!
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what happened? that happened to me v6 tho and i am now replacing pcm . dealer said it wasnt even the right pcm for my car (which i bought used from private party) broke down an hour from home.
 
nikki6Volt said:
what happened? that happened to me v6 tho and i am now replacing pcm . dealer said it wasnt even the right pcm for my car (which i bought used from private party) broke down an hour from home.
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Changed coils #4 and #6 (V8 2005) and not a single misfire since. Don't change them all at one time if you cannot afford it.
 
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