Excessive cranking issue when cold any thoughs or suggestions appreciated

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dannoltie

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Hi all im new to this forum and have a quick question regarding my 2002 Lincoln LSE with the 3.9l dohc v8....When starting the car when cold you have to crank the starter over for longer than normal for the car to fire up, this only happens after the car has sat for over an hour for example if i run in a store and go to start the car when i leave it fires right up normally. I would appreciate any input that you guys can give me on this issue i replaced the fuel filter yesterday and it is going into the shop on Monday to have the plugs swapped out to new factory motor craft ones...could this excessive cranking be caused by the high compression motor? I am new to owning one of these cars as I am used to driving trucks and when u turn the key they start right away.

Thanks Dan
 
Excessive cranking is not normal, you have one or more faults of some sort. Is your check engine light on?
Your best bet is that you have marginal COPs (Coil-On-Plug). I would replace all of the COPs while replacing the plugs. You can get new OEM COPs for about $50 each from Max at the right side of the screen. If your mechanic finds any oil in any of the plug wells, you need to stop right there and have the valve cover gaskets replaced before changing the plugs and coils.
 
joegr said:
Excessive cranking is not normal, you have one or more faults of some sort. Is your check engine light on?
Your best bet is that you have marginal COPs (Coil-On-Plug). I would replace all of the COPs while replacing the plugs. You can get new OEM COPs for about $50 each from Max at the right side of the screen. If your mechanic finds any oil in any of the plug wells, you need to stop right there and have the valve cover gaskets replaced before changing the plugs and coils.
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The check engine popped on last night while idling I was letting it warm up before i drove it and i noticed it making a slight intermittent spark knock and the check engine light was on....when the car goes in on Monday Im going to have him run the code and inspect the journals for the plugs for oil...i have my fingers crossed on it just being a coil but we will see what kind of code it pulls up....The car currently has 119000 km on it so it is still pretty fresh for an older car...I have also read that when the engine misfired the check engine light will blink i have yet to see this happen just wondering if this light is known to blink in all cases of misfiring?
 
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dannoltie said:
... just wondering if this light is known to blink in all cases of misfiring?
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No, often the light does not come on at all. Full coil failure seems to be required to get the flashing check engine light. The LS coils don't completely fail, they just become marginal due to internal high voltage breakdown. The only way to test for this is to scope them while stress testing. This is often more expensive than just replacing all of the coils. (Owner experience seems to be that once one or two coils fail, the others will all go in the next few months anyway.)
 
+1

You should consider changing all plugs coils and gaskets at that mileage. You will need to, sometime in the future. Your fuel pump may be failing too.
 
turn the key on and off.. without cranking just so that it powers the car... do that 2 to 3 times... then leave it open for 5 senconds and then crank.. that happened to mine.. i changed spark plugs to all weather one's.. some my brother recommended.. he's a mechanic.. and it never happened again..
 
soccer2live said:
turn the key on and off.. without cranking just so that it powers the car... do that 2 to 3 times... then leave it open for 5 senconds and then crank.. that happened to mine.. i changed spark plugs to all weather one's.. some my brother recommended.. he's a mechanic.. and it never happened again..
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car is going in tomorow and is having the plugs replaced with motorcraft platinum plugs will update after it has a scan done on it....the check engine light turned off yesterday so hopefully the computer logs the code
 
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Took it in today had the spark plugs fuel filter and air filter replaced....the codes that showed up were a misfire on cyl 8 and also a o2 sensor slow response wondering if the misfire could be causing this o2 code any thoughts are appreciated thanks Dan
 
dannoltie said:
Took it in today had the spark plugs fuel filter and air filter replaced....the codes that showed up were a misfire on cyl 8 and also a o2 sensor slow response wondering if the misfire could be causing this o2 code any thoughts are appreciated thanks Dan
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It might. I would wait and see. If the O2 code doesn't come back in a few weeks, then you are okay. If it does, then time for O2 sensors (I'd change both of the front ones at the same time.)
How's the starting issue now?
 
joegr said:
It might. I would wait and see. If the O2 code doesn't come back in a few weeks, then you are okay. If it does, then time for O2 sensors (I'd change both of the front ones at the same time.)
How's the starting issue now?[/QUOTE

just got the vehicle back to find out there was oil in the plug wells so
I'm having the valve cover gaskets replaced on wednesday hopefully this will get rid of my misfire issue was told by my mechanic not to replace coils as they were all working fine
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dannoltie said:
... was told by my mechanic not to replace coils as they were all working fine
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Very bad advice! The coils are damaged and must be replaced.
Below shows how to test the coils. A simple resistance check won't pick up the fault. Neither will seeing that they fire most of the time.
http://www.v8sho.com/SHO/TSB 04-16-1.pdf

Also, note that if your 2004 has less than 100K miles, Ford will replace the defective ones at no charge to you.
http://www.allstatetrucks.com/Recalls/cust satisfaction recalls/07m07/R07M07 dealer bulletin.pdf

After that, the least grief thing that you can do is to go ahead and replace the rest of the coils now. Search the forum, this is a common solution to a common problem.
 
You might as well listen to joegr. They are already in there doing the vcg's and when you go back in a few days to have them do the coils it's going to cost you more labor.
 
joegr said:
Very bad advice! The coils are damaged and must be replaced.
Below shows how to test the coils. A simple resistance check won't pick up the fault. Neither will seeing that they fire most of the time.
http://www.v8sho.com/SHO/TSB 04-16-1.pdf

Also, note that if your 2004 has less than 100K miles, Ford will replace the defective ones at no charge to you.
http://www.allstatetrucks.com/Recalls/cust satisfaction recalls/07m07/R07M07 dealer bulletin.pdf

After that, the least grief thing that you can do is to go ahead and replace the rest of the coils now. Search the forum, this is a common solution to a common problem.
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thanks for the advice I too thought that sounded a little too good to be true they said it looked like the gaskets just started leaking and it didn't penetrate the boots..I'm going to price out a coil set from around here I was thinking on calling max but am kinda thinking against that cause I'm from Canada and am not sure that kind of duty will be on them

thanks dan
 
joegr said:
Yeah, I got you mixed up with a thread on a 2004. I guess it's the oldtimers kicking in.
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Haha I know the feeling and I'm only 21 lol well I will keep you guys updated currently after new plugs fuel and air filters the car still needs to be cranked over longer than normal perhaps this could be the cause of bad coils
 
So ive been getting misfire codes on cylinder 8 so i am thinking on picking up a set of 8 coil packs off ebay wondering if anyone has had any issues with these because i can get a whole set of 8 off ebay for 20.00 more than a single one through my part store here

thanks Dan
 
dannoltie said:
So ive been getting misfire codes on cylinder 8 so i am thinking on picking up a set of 8 coil packs off ebay wondering if anyone has had any issues with these because i can get a whole set of 8 off ebay for 20.00 more than a single one through my part store here

thanks Dan
Click to expand...

Max has the OEM for around $50 each. One advantage to the OEM is that they are now on rev D or E (can't remember which). The newer revs are supposed to solve the issue with the breakdown of the epoxy inside. I don't know if they have solved it yet. I do know that they have made some attempts that didn't.
 
joegr said:
Max has the OEM for around $50 each. One advantage to the OEM is that they are now on rev D or E (can't remember which). The newer revs are supposed to solve the issue with the breakdown of the epoxy inside. I don't know if they have solved it yet. I do know that they have made some attempts that didn't.
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Yea i am aware that max can get could for around 50.00 however i am concerned on the duty that i will incur having them sent to Canada from the US that is the only thing that's holding me back from ordering them from five star
 
So I've replaced vcg's coils plugs air filter and fuel filter and I still need to excessively crank to get the engine started any suggestions? I'm lost and don't know what to try now car runs great other that starting issue
 
You may have a leaking injector issue. Injectors that won't hold pressure can cause raw fuel in the manifold. You'll have to crank long enough to clear it.
KS
 
cammerfe said:
You may have a leaking injector issue. Injectors that won't hold pressure can cause raw fuel in the manifold. You'll have to crank long enough to clear it.
KS
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That's what I'm leanin towards too as when I have to excessively crank it when it starts I smell raw fuel for a few seconds is there any way to narrow down which injector could be causing this? Are they hard to swap out cause if they are not I'll pick up some remans and pop them in
 
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