FBI Raids Liberty Dollar

fossten

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Please take the time to research the history of this company before you respond in any knee-jerk fashion. I've checked it out and this raid by the Feds looks to be quite illegal. They've been in business since 1998 and the Fed has had no issue with them until just now??? The timing (close to Ron Paul's near record campaign haul) is very suspicious as well.

http://www.libertydollar.org/ld/legal/raid.htm
 
i disagree with the raid, but i also disagree with the thought of trying to use a different dollar, not because i dont like the idea because of the fact of what the feds have done to this great country. if i tried to use this different dollar at the gas station or the bar i would get laughed at.which is wrong, in my eyes. the way things are today are not the our forefathers intended it to be! my great aunt was one of the daughters of the confederacy i have history books at home that most people wouldnt believe. and its not because their stupid its because he who wins the war writes the history. the civil war was not about slavery at all it was more about things like taxation without representation, invasion of privacy, and people making government work their lifes work. instead of good people like your neighbor or the guy down the street being able to be the next president. isnt that why we broke away from england in the first place you can thank people like KING BUSH for the way the government conducts its behavior these days! the gestapo will probably be coming through my windows soon to put me in some hole for sayin this. but if not see ya in the next thread. or maybe this one :soapbox: :soapbox:
 
IT WILL TAKE ALOT FOR AMERICA TO BE AMERICA AGAIN. is there some other country we can make a good one? besides civil war, were screwed. and no one wants things to come to that. i wont fight my neighbor, and thats what it would be. THE MAN IS TOO DEEP IN OUR LIVES! for instance i'm facing prison time for possesion of marijuana, on nov 26. liberty dollar wasnt doing anything wrong, but when you go up against the king. YOURE FFFFED. MAYBE IF MORE PEOPLE WOULD BRING THIS ISSUE TO THEIR HEART WE COULD DO SOMETHING. but til then we're boned. sorry i may be a dumb redneck but i can see whats happening to our country! look at gas prices since bush has been pres. when i started driving gas was 87 cents a gal. i would do what i have too, but would my neighbor and so on. sorry that i ranted on the subject. the government makes me mad. we arent free we just think we are. WELL I DONT AT LEAST. please dont think of me as a racist because of what i said of the civil war. YOU HAVE NOT READ THE BOOKS I HAVE. BRING ON THE FEEDBACK, i wont see this till tomorrow after work. give this all a chance and do some research. although ill doubt youll find alot. STILL LOOKIN FOR A PLACE I COULD LIVE FREE. oh yeah the gestapo arent here yet. but still waiting. im sure you will disagree with me, but really think about the money, the people and the ignorant people, that the winners of the wars taught!:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :headbang:
 
i disagree with the raid, but i also disagree with the thought of trying to use a different dollar, not because i dont like the idea because of the fact of what the feds have done to this great country. if i tried to use this different dollar at the gas station or the bar i would get laughed at.which is wrong, in my eyes.
I asked you to do a little research before you posted. I can see that you did not. The Liberty Dollar has never been presented as "legal tender." It is simply a (semi) precious metal in the shape of a coin. The company has never advocated using it as money, only as a convenient vehicle for storing precious metals. The argument could have been made in court, but instead the FEDS just decided to go in and steal everything.

oh yeah the gestapo arent here yet. but still waiting.

You ever heard of the BATFE?
 
I asked you to do a little research before you posted. I can see that you did not. The Liberty Dollar has never been presented as "legal tender." It is simply a (semi) precious metal in the shape of a coin. The company has never advocated using it as money, only as a convenient vehicle for storing precious metals. The argument could have been made in court, but instead the FEDS just decided to go in and steal everything.

You ever heard of the BATFE?
From what I read, the Liberty Dollar is being advocated to use as a barter instrument for goods and services instead of legal currency.

Why use & accept the Liberty Dollar

No doubt Von Nothaus has an agenda which is to replace legal currency with his Liberty Dollars.

The Goals of the Liberty Dollar
 
From what I read, the Liberty Dollar is being advocated to use as a barter instrument for goods and services instead of legal currency.

Why use & accept the Liberty Dollar

No doubt Von Nothaus has an agenda which is to replace legal currency with his Liberty Dollars.

The Goals of the Liberty Dollar

Yeah, I read that stuff too. It looks like there are literally hundreds of thousands of people who are willing to see the Liberty Dollar succeed. And Bernard is willing to risk going to prison in order to succeed. I hope to God he wins - our Federal fiat currency is circling the drain, has been for decades.
 
Glenn Beck will have Bernard von Nothaus on his show tonight at 9pm on CNN Headline news.
 
so basically you tell me to do research. disagree with what i say. and then when someone tells you the same thing i read you agree with them and say that you hope the liberty dollar succeeds because real currency is crap. :q . what are you just looking for others to argue with or what. and the gestapo is merely a comparison of bushs rigged elections, invasions of privacy, and outlooks on making himself mighty not the country, :q :q :q :q.
 
www.washingtontimes.com
Article published Nov 28, 2007

Ron Paul and the money cops
Richard W. Rahn

Assume you, a Justice Department official, are a secret supporter of Texas Rep. Ron Paul for president and want to help your candidate. You know Mr. Paul wants to abolish the Federal Reserve, the Internal Revenue Service, the FBI, and wants money to be backed by gold, silver and/or other precious metals. You also know his critics claim he is paranoid about the federal government abusing its powers.

You then realize that in one lightening action you can demonstrate Mr. Paul is not paranoid and, at the same time, highlight the issues of sound money and government abuse of civil liberties.

To do so you could have the FBI raid the offices of a Paul supporter who is making and selling "Ron Paul Dollars" made of copper, silver, gold and platinum, and seize all the coins. Bizarre as it sounds, that is exactly what agents of the FBI did last week.

Needless to say, this action of the Feds has energized many Paul supporters and brought more people into his camp.

Despite my scenario above, I doubt the seizing of the coins was instigated by a Ron Paul supporter in the government; more likely, it was taken by overzealous federal agents who neither had the wit to understand the political significance of what they were doing nor a full appreciation of the importance of civil liberties. It should strike all Americans, regardless of political ideology, that seizing objects that bear the likeness of a candidate and are clearly designed to promote that candidate, regardless of what they are made of, is an assault on our basic freedoms and our electoral process.

Can you imagine the outrage from the mainstream press if the Feds had seized metal campaign buttons produced by a supporter of Hillary Clinton with her likeness on it?

The company whose "Ron Paul Dollars" and other private coins were seized by the Feds is "Liberty Services." According to both the Paul campaign and Liberty Services, the company's actions were not part of, affiliated with or authorized by the campaign. The FBI claims it is investigating the company for "making or possessing likeness of coins," mail fraud, wire fraud, money laundering and conspiracy. Yet, as of this writing, the company had not been charged with or indicted for any crime, let alone convicted.

To understand the very slippery slope the government is now on, it is important to understand what is legal and what is illegal. The U.S. Code states, "Whoever ... attempts to utter or pass, any coins of gold or silver or other metal, or alloys of metals, intended for use as current money, whether in the resemblance of coins of the United States or of foreign countries, or of original design, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned."

Private mints and organizations can legally produce various types of commemorative coins (which the U.S. Mint insists they call medallions) from any metal, including gold, as long as they do not claim they are "money" and as long as they clearly do not appear to be counterfeits of some U.S. or foreign government coins.

Any citizen may possess, buy and sell as many gold, silver or other metal coins (medallions) produced by governments and private mints as he chooses. However, he may not pass off any of them as "money," except the "legal tender" coins minted by the government, such as the U.S. "quarter."

Now, you might be thinking if you can sell the coins in your coin collection for money, whether or not they are U.S. legal tender, what is the difference?

This nonsense only gets worse. The U.S. government mints and sells "American Eagle" gold coins which are "legal tender" even though they sell for about 20 times their face amount these days. You can also buy and sell gold coins produced by foreign governments or private mints (commemorative medallions), with same amount of gold in them as the U.S. government coins, for about the same price as the U.S. legal tender coins (the amount of gold largely determines the price, except for rare coins that have an additional numismatic value).

In addition to the legal tender laws, a major reason precious metal coins or "medallions" are not commonly used in normal transactions is that you are supposed to pay a capital gains tax on any difference between your purchase and sale price, though the gain may be due solely to (Fed-caused) inflation. Yet you are not allowed to deduct the loss of value due to inflation of your government-issued "quarter" or other legal tender from your taxes.

Finally, though some in the FBI appear to have forgotten, anyone can legally produce and give away or sell materials in support of any candidate as long as those actions are independent of the candidate's campaign.

Many great economic scholars, such as F.A. Hayek, have written on the desirability of denationalizating currencies in protecting the value of money, and civil libertarians both right and left have correctly criticized many IRS actions and those of other federal law enforcement agencies.

While other candidates have differences with some of Ron Paul's positions, as I do, they should not continue to ignore the problems of sound money and IRS and FBI abuse. If they fail to come up with their own solutions, they are likely to see his support continue to rise.

Richard W. Rahn is the chairman of the Institute for Global Economic Growth.

© 2007 The Washington Times, LLC.
 
so basically you tell me to do research. disagree with what i say. and then when someone tells you the same thing i read you agree with them and say that you hope the liberty dollar succeeds because real currency is crap. :q . what are you just looking for others to argue with or what. and the gestapo is merely a comparison of bushs rigged elections, invasions of privacy, and outlooks on making himself mighty not the country, :q :q :q :q.



I see you've met our Fossten -- :)
 
that was not a good night for someone to disagree with me thank you for the mutual feelings joey. iwas not in such a good mood.:Beer
 
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Here's the Glenn Beck interview:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvHhqr8OeFc

And with Kudlow:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-aLJJ-_WYE&feature=related
The Kudlow provides a better explanation of what the "product" is.
 

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