so the old CEL came on again!!!

[luckieleo]

last night i got the check engine light. i was thinking to myself this week, hmm. my car has actually been driving nicely, accelerating okay, not dying when i accelerate really fast at a green light, and of course, last night, it starts the shaking when i'm in Drive, with my foot on the brake. if i put it in park, its alot less shaking, but this mornging i didnt let the car warm up too much, and just drove off right away, and i had to really press down on the gas to get it to go, and it puttered away.... but the CEL is still on as of this mornign.

i'm going to autozone after work, and HOPEFULLy the CEL will stay on so i can get the free diag. i will post the code on here afterwards. i'm thinking i gotta order some coils & just replace em all this weekend. supposed to be in the 40's or 50's & sunny!

i had a misfire in cyl#1 and #5 a couple months ago, and the only thing we did to fix it was put some grease on the boots and that cleared the code...

heres the question... if i just replaced the spark plugs 30,000 miles ago, should i do them again so that they are fresh with the coil packs? i bought the expensive ones from the dealer. i think the 6 of them ran me around $65 total... they are supposed to be good for 100k, but if you were me would you replace them all with the coil packs???


also, how much time is this coil pack replacement gonna take on the v6??
anyone in the chicago area who might wanna come out & help me if i have trouble?

my dad's good with cars, but i dont think he's ever done coil packs. he's used to old school cars...we should be fine, but just in case, anyone who has done this want to pm me your number just in case...???

 

[eL eS]

I intend to replace my plugsevery 25/30k miles regardless of what the owners manual states. From what I have observed it isnt a realistic expectation to go 100k without changing them.

The LH, Drivers side plugs will be a snap. But teh RH side on the V6 will take you several hours.

the cylinder order on teh V6 is


Rear of engine
3 6
2 5
1 4
Front of engine

You might want to go ahead and replace the coils on 123 since you will be in htere any way and it might be worth the effort to go in for the PCV and valve tube which could add a few more hours but save you a lot of trouble up the road.

Post the DTC's later and we can come up with a good strategy then.

 

[FreeFaller]

You're definately misfiring. First things first get the codes pulled like you said...most likely though it will just tell you which cylinders are jacked... Then pull those plugs and check your spark as well as for signs of oil leaking into the combustion chamber. I just had the exact same problem on my vehicle and it was all due to a blown gasket...

One more question...have you notice a sulfur/acrid smell when the engine is running. If you do then you know that you're engine is not burning the gas very well at all (either due to bad spark or bad air [EGR stuck open])and the computer is enriching the mixture in an effort to alleviate the problem. This floods the Catylitic converter with unburnt fuel and makes it stink like a hot spring.

I don't know a whole lot about the V6 but these are some of my ideas based on what I've had to go through.

 

[luckieleo]

You're definately misfiring. First things first get the codes pulled like you said...most likely though it will just tell you which cylinders are jacked... Then pull those plugs and check your spark as well as for signs of oil leaking into the combustion chamber. I just had the exact same problem on my vehicle and it was all due to a blown gasket...

One more question...have you notice a sulfur/acrid smell when the engine is running. If you do then you know that you're engine is not burning the gas very well at all (either due to bad spark or bad air [EGR stuck open])and the computer is enriching the mixture in an effort to alleviate the problem. This floods the Catylitic converter with unburnt fuel and makes it stink like a hot spring.

I don't know a whole lot about the V6 but these are some of my ideas based on what I've had to go through.

is the smell really strong or is it a faint smell of sulfur??? one time my bf commented on something smelling weird, but i didnt notice. if theres a bad spark or whatever, will the smell be very strong & i would know for sure?

also whats an EGR??? what does that stand for???

 

[l-m tech]

egr means exhaust gas recirculation,it is a valve that opens up when commanded,or stuck open,and flows exhaust gases back through the engine helping to lower emissions.the spark plug thing i would atleast pull them out and check the shell of the plug and look for a carbon trail.its usually a jagged black trail that will run down the side of the plug,causeing a miss.electricity flows the least path of resistance.inspection only takes a minute.have been bit by this before.and had to go back in.good luck.

 

[FreeFaller]

EGR (Exaust Gas Recirculation Valve)... Most cars have them...can't say for sure it the LS6 does. Do you know Noah??? But basically it is a valve that recirculates a little bit of exaust fumes back into the combustion chamber to burn up any unused gas vapor. This is only supposed to happen at near WOT, otherwise the engine will barely run. What happens is that older engines begin to build up carbon inside the recirculation lines and over time pieces break free...these pieces then get lodged in the valve and constantly allowing exaust gas into the intake. The best way to tell if this is the problem is to put the vehicle in park and rev the engine. If the problem goes away at high (1500 or so) rpms then you know your EGR is stuck open.

As far as the smell, it can be strong or faint depending on how far the problem has progressed. Usually with an ignition problem the smell is not as bad as with an intake/air problem. But either way, if you find yourself sitting at the drive up ATM and wondering what the hell it is that smells like a sewage treatment plant...it's probably your LS...check your spark.

What do you think Noah? You've got the V6.

 

[FreeFaller]

Aw crap...thanks l-m tech...I guess I'm too slow...

 

[eL eS]

EGR (Exaust Gas Recirculation Valve)... Most cars have them...can't say for sure it the LS6 does. Do you know Noah??? But basically it is a valve that recirculates a little bit of exaust fumes back into the combustion chamber to burn up any unused gas vapor. This is only supposed to happen at near WOT, otherwise the engine will barely run. What happens is that older engines begin to build up carbon inside the recirculation lines and over time pieces break free...these pieces then get lodged in the valve and constantly allowing exaust gas into the intake. The best way to tell if this is the problem is to put the vehicle in park and rev the engine. If the problem goes away at high (1500 or so) rpms then you know your EGR is stuck open.

As far as the smell, it can be strong or faint depending on how far the problem has progressed. Usually with an ignition problem the smell is not as bad as with an intake/air problem. But either way, if you find yourself sitting at the drive up ATM and wondering what the hell it is that smells like a sewage treatment plant...it's probably your LS...check your spark.

What do you think Noah? You've got the V6.

I did not have a problem with my egr but I did replace it becasue it has to come off during the plug/coil change. The egr is on the RH side of the engine just lower left of the throttle body. It has a black top and is connected to a long pipe that runs toward the back of the car.

 

[luckieleo]

I did not have a problem with my egr but I did replace it becasue it has to come off during the plug/coil change. The egr is on the RH side of the engine just lower left of the throttle body. It has a black top and is connected to a long pipe that runs toward the back of the car.

when you say RH, are you saying drivers side?

 

[eL eS]

when you say RH, are you saying drivers side?

opposite side. The manufacturer defines RH as passenger and LH as driver.

 

[luckieleo]

You're definately misfiring. First things first get the codes pulled like you said...most likely though it will just tell you which cylinders are jacked... Then pull those plugs and check your spark as well as for signs of oil leaking into the combustion chamber. I just had the exact same problem on my vehicle and it was all due to a blown gasket...

One more question...have you notice a sulfur/acrid smell when the engine is running. If you do then you know that you're engine is not burning the gas very well at all (either due to bad spark or bad air [EGR stuck open])and the computer is enriching the mixture in an effort to alleviate the problem. This floods the Catylitic converter with unburnt fuel and makes it stink like a hot spring.

I don't know a whole lot about the V6 but these are some of my ideas based on what I've had to go through.

YAY!!! i fixed it!!!

i went to autozone right after work. the code read out PO306... which was a cyl#6 misfire. luckily enough, cyl 6 is not under the manifold, so i got home, let the car cool off, went in there & pulled out the coil pack/boot to reveal OIL IN THE WELL!!! not flooded or anything, but a small tiny puddle of burnt oil in the well... pulled out the spark plug & the "screw" part was all oily. cleaned it all out, checked cyl#5 and the same thing, a tinly puddle of burnt oil in the well. a little less than#6 had. but #5 spark plug didnt have any oil on the spark plug itself. cleaned it all out. #4 didnt have anything at all... and we were not about totake off the manifold to check 1,2, and 3. thats a pain in the ass, and i wasnt about to spend 2 hours for nothing.

i also changed the cabin air filter & broke all of the pin thingys that hold the cowl cover on. :bash: so after we cleaned off the 2 oily wells/spark plugs, i started the car to see if the CEL was still there & it was. so i drove over to autozone to see if they had those cowl cover clips... (2 miles away from home)...and went to start the car to go home & the CEL turned off!! YAY!

so its fixed for now, but i'm sure it will come back. i'm guessing this means i need to replace the valve cover gaskets?? at least on the 4,5,6 cyl side...


if it werent for the help on this forum, i wouldnt have known to check the well for oil... thanks for the help. :Beer

 

[l-m tech]

dont forget when you have to change the "hard" side ,relace the pcv hoses that go out as low as 20k,glad you got the car fixed .

 

[eL eS]

dont forget when you have to change the "hard" side ,relace the pcv hoses that go out as low as 20k,glad you got the car fixed .

no doubt. I can't tell you how much trouble it will save if you replace the tube when you do the gaskets. I'' be honest it is a pain in the :q to get to but if you replace it along with the pcv you can continue to travel in confidence.

There are two gaskets for the V6 Valve cover:

Right XW4Z6584DA (need 1)
Left XW4Z6584EA (need 1)
Center XW4Z6C527BA (need 2)

Should be able to get them all for under 30 bux.

The PCV is
2L5Z6A666BA you can get it for under 20 you only need one but you will need a piece of elbo tubing. I tokk mine off and went to autozone and they had a piece that match it. I can't find any specs on it and did not measure mine before reinstall.

 

[luckieleo]

no doubt. I can't tell you how much trouble it will save if you replace the tube when you do the gaskets. I'' be honest it is a pain in the :q to get to but if you replace it along with the pcv you can continue to travel in confidence.

There are two gaskets for the V6 Valve cover:

Right XW4Z6584DA (need 1)
Left XW4Z6584EA (need 1)
Center XW4Z6C527BA (need 2)

Should be able to get them all for under 30 bux.

The PCV is
2L5Z6A666BA you can get it for under 20 you only need one but you will need a piece of elbo tubing. I tokk mine off and went to autozone and they had a piece that match it. I can't find any specs on it and did not measure mine before reinstall.

Any pics of this PCV??? what does it look like? i wouldnt know what it looks like or where its at???
i've already replaced some hose in this car... not sure if its the hose your talking about? it was elbow shaped... but it was a tube that went bad & caused coolant to leak.. what does this pcv do when it goes bad? is it hard to remove or is it just a matter of taking off a couple clamps...?

 

[eL eS]

Any pics of this PCV??? what does it look like? i wouldnt know what it looks like or where its at???
i've already replaced some hose in this car... not sure if its the hose your talking about? it was elbow shaped... but it was a tube that went bad & caused coolant to leak.. what does this pcv do when it goes bad? is it hard to remove or is it just a matter of taking off a couple clamps...?

you have to remove the upper and lower intakes. You want get to it too easily. The car will run like :q when it goes bad and I have run in to several V6 owners recently that have had to replace this tube. I would be willing to bet yours is probably going to suffer the same fate.

 

[luckieleo]

you have to remove the upper and lower intakes. You want get to it too easily. The car will run like :q when it goes bad and I have run in to several V6 owners recently that have had to replace this tube. I would be willing to bet yours is probably going to suffer the same fate.

want to take a ride to chicago & come fix it for me??? cuz i wouldnt have a clue what to look for.. :dancefool
i will reward you with beer! :Beer
no really though, anyone have a how-to on this?


and thanks everyone for all the replies!!! :monkey:

 

[eL eS]

I would help out if you were closer. I do have your gmail account and will email it over to you tonight. I did not get to photo document my repair because I was pressed for time. I will send you my phone number as well just in case you need a little direction. There are some hard to reach and hard to see things you have to remove and it might help to have a little verbal coaching.

 

[luckieleo]

I would help out if you were closer. I do have your gmail account and will email it over to you tonight. I did not get to photo document my repair because I was pressed for time. I will send you my phone number as well just in case you need a little direction. There are some hard to reach and hard to see things you have to remove and it might help to have a little verbal coaching.

thanks, i'll look out for it.
i'll probably photo document the valve cover gaskets & pcv since i have yet to see the step by step for the v6. wont be this weekend though. just placed the order thru fordpartsnetwork, so probably next weekend when i have lots of time!
seriously though, why is the v6 more complicated than the v8?!!!!! wtf!!! :Bang

 

[eL eS]

the RH side is so much more difficult than the LH due to the way the upper intake is mounted and they mounted a bunch of stuff on the back of the intake that has to be removed before you remove the intake else you will end up breaking some vacuum lines and electrical connectors.


Once you do it the first timeit gets easier the second... but if you replace the pcv and elbow you shouldnt have to make a second trip in. Ask Chris he can tell you too. That fuel injector electrical connector was a pain in the :q to remove.