Stores’ treatment of shoplifters tests legal limits

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Stores’ treatment of shoplifters tests legal limits

By Corey Kilgannon and Jeffrey E. Singer
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updated 6:51 p.m. ET, Mon., June 21, 2010

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/22/nyregion/22shoplift.html


The A & N Food Market on Main Street in Flushing, Queens, has an almost entirely Chinese clientele. The inventory includes live eels, turtles and frogs, frozen duck tongue and canned congee. These goods, like products sold in every neighborhood of the city, attract their share of shoplifters. But A & N Food Market has an unusual way of dealing with the problem.

First, suspected shoplifters caught by the store’s security guards or staff members have their identification seized. Then, they are photographed holding up the items they are accused of trying to steal. Finally, workers at the store threaten to display the photographs to embarrass them, and to call the police — unless the accused thieves hand over money.

“We usually fine them $400,” said Tem Shieh, 60, the manager, who keeps track of customers on 30 video monitors in the store’s surveillance system. “If they don’t have the money, then we usually hold their identification and give them a chance to go get it.”

The practice of catching suspected shoplifters and demanding payment is an import from China, several experts in retail loss prevention said, where there is a traditional slogan that some storekeepers post: “Steal one, fine 10.” Whether this practice is legal in the United States is open to interpretation.
New York State law allows “shopkeepers’ privileges” that fall somewhere between the police and a citizen’s arrest. The law also details “civil recovery statutes,” by which retailers may use the threat of a civil lawsuit to recover substantial settlements for even minor thievery. But threatening to report that someone has committed a crime can be considered a form of extortion.

Neither the Police Department nor the Queens district attorney’s office said it had received any complaints about the practice. But critics of the practice argue that the accused shoplifters are deprived of basic civil rights and the usual assurances in public law proceedings, like the right to a lawyer and freedom from coercion, and are not being held by adequately trained security officials with proper oversight.

“If a store owner says he’ll call the police unless you pay up, that’s extortion, that’s illegal,” said Steven Wong, a community advocate in Chinatown, sitting in his office above a restaurant on Chatham Square. “And putting up pictures in public, calling someone a thief who has never even been formally charged, that’s a violation of their civil rights.”

It is unclear exactly how rampant this practice is, and whether threats of arrest are always used, but it exists in certain predominantly Chinese neighborhoods around the city.

Many accused shoplifters plead poverty. But they usually manage to come up with money to pay their way out of being publicly shamed and arrested, Mr. Shieh said, often after calling upon friends and relatives for the cash. Unfounded fears of being deported often color their panicked responses.
“Two weeks ago, a woman tried to take two bags of grapes worth maybe $10,” he said, speaking in Chinese.

The woman first said she had no money, but somehow found some. “She came back with eight new $50 bills,” Mr. Shieh said.
At the Chang Jiang Supermarket on Kissena Boulevard in Flushing, where hawkers of fresh produce in sidewalk bins continuously yell out specials in Chinese, credit cards are accepted from accused shoplifters for payment to avoid arrest, said the manager, Wu Jian Si.
“They just say, ‘Run the credit card,’ ” said Mr. Wu, 30, speaking in Chinese. “They have money.”

Fliers posted in the store display images of accused shoplifters and of a man being escorted by the police, along with warnings in Chinese and English that say, “If we catch, we will take your photo for records and your fine will be $400 or you go to prison.”
The fines are necessary, Mr. Wu said, because the police do not always arrest the accused shoplifters. And even if they do, Mr. Wu said, “The most they’ll get is 24 hours.”

Many of the accused shoplifters are immigrants who have a heightened fear of authority, of those in uniform, and they often lack proper immigration status, said Jason Sanchez, 24, who has worked as a security guard at several Chinese markets in Flushing.
“They figure they’ll be deported, so they’ll do anything to get the money,” Mr. Sanchez said. “Some stores ask for $400, or some ask for $200 — it becomes a negotiation.”

In an example of the wall-of-shame style that certain stores use, a grocery called NY Tak Shing Hong, on East Broadway in Manhattan’s Chinatown, posts photographs near the cash registers, some bearing names, addresses and Social Security numbers of the persons depicted. Several also include simple descriptions in Chinese, like “Stole Medicine” and “Thief.”

Some store owners share their photographs with other stores, or post them in other store branches they own. For example, an image in the Chang Jiang market of a man holding up a large stash of live fish in a plastic bag, with the words “Big Thief,” can also be seen in several other stores in the area.
The Chung Fat Supermarket, on Main Street in Flushing, posts photographs of accused shoplifters on the front doors and up above the cashiers.
“All we can do is put up their pictures and let them know we do something about it,” a manager, Sam Lim, 42, said in Chinese, referring to the many photographs of suspected shoplifters posted near the cashiers.

Chung Fat has 100 surveillance cameras. According to a sign in a storage area, first-time shoplifters face a $500 fine, and repeat offenders must pay $2,000. In reality, though, store officials acknowledge they are rarely able to collect much money from offenders.
Some of these enforcement policies have recently come under fire. Last month, two Chinese immigrants spoke out publicly after being wrongly accused of shoplifting at the New York Supermarket, a store under the Manhattan Bridge in Chinatown that posts photographs of accused shoplifters next to the cashier, behind the live crabs and eels.

One woman, Li Yuxin, said that after being falsely accused of thievery, she began weeping in front of a crowd of shoppers. Another woman, Liang Huanqiong, a 60-year-old home attendant, also claimed that false accusations of theft damaged her reputation and caused mental anguish.
The episodes made headlines in Chinese-language newspapers, and store officials apologized to the women and said they would train employees to better recognize thievery and use more sensitivity in approaching suspected shoplifters, the articles reported.

Both women are being advocated for by Mr. Wong, who is critical of the practices despite the apparent vagueness of the law. The police declined to discuss the legality of the practice without specific examples.
In New York State, a retailer may sue a thief (who has stolen any type of item, costly or not) for the item’s retail price up to $1,500 if the item is not resalable, along with a penalty of $75 to $500, depending on the item’s price. Usually, the retailer threatens legal action and settles for several hundred dollars, experts in loss prevention said. This process is separate from criminal prosecution and can take place without arrest or conviction, even if the case is criminally tried and thrown out.

Richard Hollinger, a sociologist and criminologist at the University of Florida, said that a shopkeeper demanding money on the spot is a version of the legal process of civil recovery outside the law. He said it can veer into extortion, which is defined by laws in New York State as demanding payment using the fear of accusing “some person of a crime or cause criminal charges to be instituted against him.”
Mr. Sanchez, the security guard, said that some stores parade the suspected shoplifter up and down the aisles, announcing the attempted theft to customers.
“It is truly the walk of shame,” he said.
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The latest import from China?
And it doesn't use government resources for enforcement.
Pay me some money or I'll have you arrested....
I wonder who are the critics of this practice.
 
not sure how they get away with that, i went to high school with a girl who got sued for stopping a shoplifter


$400,00 is a small price to pay to not get caught up in the american police legal system for petty crime like this.
 
If I witness somebody committing a crime, and I demand money in exchange for me not turning them in, is that not considered blackmail?
 
If I witness somebody committing a crime, and I demand money in exchange for me not turning them in, is that not considered blackmail?

If you're the one the crime has been commited against then you're just speeding up the civil process.

Remember the shoplifter started the situation by commiting the crime so blackmail may be an efficient punishment and deterrant.

I thought you like the keep goverment out of it philosophy where the free market does it better.
 
...I don't think I have an issue here.

There's no abuse by the state.
The state isn't enabling abuse.
All the parties involved actually benefit.
And it's an effective, independent way to deter crime at a massive store in another one of the China-towns that have begun taking over all of the old ethnic neighborhoods of New York.

And if they charge you wrong, you tell them to screw off and talk with the police.
 
If you're the one the crime has been commited against then you're just speeding up the civil process.

Remember the shoplifter started the situation by commiting the crime so blackmail may be an efficient punishment and deterrant.

I thought you like the keep goverment out of it philosophy where the free market does it better.
That's a pretty good argument.
 
...I don't think I have an issue here.

There's no abuse by the state.
The state isn't enabling abuse.
All the parties involved actually benefit.
And it's an effective, independent way to deter crime at a massive store in another one of the China-towns that have begun taking over all of the old ethnic neighborhoods of New York.

And if they charge you wrong, you tell them to screw off and talk with the police.

They have your picture with the stolen stuff - and a 'confession' of sorts...

The store owner takes your $400 and all is good.

But, what happens if they decide they want more - Next week? Another $50 to stay quiet? The store owner still has the photos...

The mob would like their business model ;)
 
But, what happens if they decide they want more - Next week? Another $50 to stay quiet? The store owner still has the photos...

The mob would like their business model ;)

That is a BIG logical leap to base solely on speculation.

Going from what is, at best, questionable actions by the store owner to the store owner flat out breaking the law by blackmailing.

To say that the mob would like their business model is to then assume your speculation is true.

On a related note to this topic: there is a business here in Topeka that puts the full name of people who write bad checks on a billboard outside their business.
 
They have your picture with the stolen stuff - and a 'confession' of sorts...

The store owner takes your $400 and all is good.

But, what happens if they decide they want more - Next week? Another $50 to stay quiet? The store owner still has the photos...

The mob would like their business model ;)

Seriously Fox

Nobody's going to get double billed for shoplifting.

Typical small shoplifters aren't running a business the mob can skim off of.

Maybe a professional ring could be made to pay tribute.

They've got you red handed pretty well.

If you get a receipt that would say you've paid for your crime
and the practice is in the grey area so no one wants to take this further.

If you engage in illegal or questionable activities the law is not there to help you and you have to fall back on the law of wits.
 
They have your picture with the stolen stuff - and a 'confession' of sorts...

The store owner takes your $400 and all is good.

But, what happens if they decide they want more - Next week? Another $50 to stay quiet? The store owner still has the photos...

The mob would like their business model ;)

If you don't want that threat, then you can
chose the option of having them hand you over to the police.
 
It's still wordy, since you asked...:D

The concise version is "They've got you red handed."


I threw the pretty well in there because there have been a few false accusations as the article points out.
 
I'll just shoot em and burn the pictures and confession....problem solved. Loss Prevention does not have police or military training in those areas (maybe some bigger corperations) but no less have as much rights as a civilian. If asking for more money...I'd get my friends and kill em. Why not end one illegal activity...with another? Hell, our government does it ;-)
 
I'll just shoot em and burn the pictures and confession....problem solved. Loss Prevention does not have police or military training in those areas (maybe some bigger corperations) but no less have as much rights as a civilian. If asking for more money...I'd get my friends and kill em. Why not end one illegal activity...with another? Hell, our government does it ;-)

It's nice to see you sober ;) and that you believe in the punishment fitting the crime.
This isn't Walmart's or some other major retailers policy and is working in it's present Chinatown locations.
But we know you like to say outrageous things.:eek:
 
It's nice to see you sober ;) and that you believe in the punishment fitting the crime.
This isn't Walmart's or some other major retailers policy and is working in it's present Chinatown locations.
But we know you like to say outrageous things.:eek:

I do say outrageous things. I'm like the thinner/buffer/better looking Micheal Moore :p


I do believe in punishment fitting the crime. Same goes the chick who got punched by a Seattle cop (The cop is an authority figure vs rent-a-cops)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_P5jOoDDbI&feature=related
 
That is a BIG logical leap to base solely on speculation.

Going from what is, at best, questionable actions by the store owner to the store owner flat out breaking the law by blackmailing.

To say that the mob would like their business model is to then assume your speculation is true.

On a related note to this topic: there is a business here in Topeka that puts the full name of people who write bad checks on a billboard outside their business.

Of course it is speculation - that is what you do in cases like this - what 'could happen' and perhaps why this isn't SOP.

Because that is what people do - they escalate everything.

You just broke the law - I won't tell anyone - but you need to pay me to keep silent.

I don't have enough to pay my bills this week - I know - I could shake down these people who broke the law in my store last week. They will continue to want to 'save face'.

From the onset the store owner is depending on the 'silence' of the offender, they won't tell anyone, it is too embarrassing.

Plus - then the shoplifter doesn't have a record - needed if the next guy wants to prosecute. Three strikes and you're out doesn't work so well if the authorities don't know about the other incidents.
 
Because that is what people do - they escalate everything.

They can escalate things, however, that doesn't mean that they do.

If the business escalates things in the in the manner you speak, they would be breaking the law. Incentives matter and the law proves a negative incentive to doing what you are suggesting. Considering the incentive structure involved, your speculation seems without merit.
 
If the stores tried to keep getting money out of shoplifters after they paid once the whole informal thing would fall apart.
This has developed itself into a known routine.
 

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