02 LSE V8 - Hard start - fuel smell - running rich ?
- Thread starter Lseme
- Start date
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
I think that the most likely answer is ................................................................................................................................................................................................. Marginal coils. I think you should probably start with replacing all coils (use Motorcraft) and all plugs (set the gap to 1.0mm, no more & no less). I think I've seen this somewhere before...
G-RELL
FULLY DIPPED LS
are marginal coils a problem with the LS... I had a buddies uncle, who knows a shop guy, that said I should just run some carb cleaner through it... will any carb cleaner work?
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
Often, it does not. If you want more detail, a little searching will show that COPs (coils) on the LS are one of the most discussed problem topics...
89k
Unknown - 2 owner car
Unknown service history
I can start there by cleaning MAF - how much can that play into it ?
roncoinc
Well-Known LVC Member
Look,,you got an old $1ooo car,,you can prob get 1/2 that for scrap..
maybe sell the tires and some parts and be ahead..
As you probably noticed there will not be much help on this forum.
" MOST " members here would rather entertain themselves by making fun of an honest question than posting help to a newbie.
with that said there are a " couple" of members that will help point you in the right direction IF they feel you have asked a question properly..
Listen to joeegr.
RigsLS
Dedicated LVC Member
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^ and this fact would mostly be due because people do not read nor search, they just ask the same questions over and over again.
Have a look a the stickies, so much information and links to relevant matters in there.
Have a look a the stickies, so much information and links to relevant matters in there.
if theres 89k on the clock and your coils are original youre actually wasting money by NOT replacing them asap... but that begs the question: are your coils original and are they under extended warranty? i dunno about an 02v8 extended warranty.. maybe someone that has one can chime in. i think the extended warranties are detailed in tsb's/recalls for the given year, so you can search those. dont expect lincoln/ford to help you, or be truthful with you, or even fix them without a fight even if they are warrantied.
to determine if they are original coils is tough, but generally you can look at the top of the modules. if they are all motorcraft and they are all the same they are probably originals.. but then again theres really no way to know for sure abt the age. the only thing that is for sure, is that youre lucky to get over 60k out of coils. so if those ran for 89k just know that they are past their useful life and are a ticking time bomb. its best to replace them all at once bc one old one could damage any new ones.
i dunno if you have an advance auto close, but i got mine there with a lifetime warranty and took advantage of their coupons. a coupon for buy $50 save $20 or buy $100 save $40 <sometimes save $50 off $100 too> is the best way to go. break up the orders if need be, to use more than one coupon. i dunno the current coupon code, but if you search slickdeals.net for advance auto you will find the coupons i described.
the advance auto coils are by bwd/intermotor <it might be 'bdw', i dont recall>.. but anyways theyre made in usa, have a lifetime warranty, and are like less than half the price of the motorcraft/visteon/oem ones, which are no warranty and chinese... i have the bdw/intermotor ones from advance in my ls, an 05 v6, with zero issues. i wouldnt imagine they are much much diff v8-v6. i would caution against getting any brand other than the bwd/intermotor or the motorcraft/visteon or other brands that come recommended by someone successfully running them here bc you could be throwing money away. personally, i say stay away from motorcraft/visteon/oem bc they are known to fail around 60k, so obviously they are KNOWN to be somewhat subpar and expensive. might as well grab something with a warranty. plus the bwd/intermotors are usa mfr vs motorcraft/visteon/oem being china mfr... thats almost a no brainer to me.
but back to your question, how much does a maf play into 'it'?? who knows... your issue isnt 100% clear. 'fuel smell', 'hard start', and 'lower mpg than expected'... are you sure its an abnormal fuel smell? what exactly do you mean by 'hard start'? obviously it did start, so what is the idle rough or something? 'low mpg' these cars typically get worse mpg than listed on the epa sticker... how many mpg are you generally talking abt?
so youre issues maybe leaning towards normal... no way to know for sure over the internet. my cheap guesses would be clean the MAF, change the fuel filter, and run injector cleaner. if your problems are overstated then the 3 of those should cure it. i think your problems are overstated bc you dont have a code or a significant issue when driving the car such as hesitate/poor shifting/wrench light/other check engine light worthy symptoms. if it were running rich i would imagine you would have a code for that as well.
so yea the others are probably right to say coils.. but there are a few other things you need to do anyways <maf, fuel filter, injector cleaner>, so you might as well do those first before you throw the coils at it...
and fwiw, to the ppl being useless twd the new ppl... this guy has a motor with 89k... no matter the price tag why the fck would you scrap it?? get real. if he had 289k then youre maybe in the ballpark with that comment.... then the ppl who are sayign blah blah def coils go search etc... he doesnt have any other typical failing coil symptoms described... no missing, no hesitating, no wrench light, no check engine light, etc.
he may be a new guy, but his questions are 100% legit. if you dont like it dont read/comment... pretty easy...
to determine if they are original coils is tough, but generally you can look at the top of the modules. if they are all motorcraft and they are all the same they are probably originals.. but then again theres really no way to know for sure abt the age. the only thing that is for sure, is that youre lucky to get over 60k out of coils. so if those ran for 89k just know that they are past their useful life and are a ticking time bomb. its best to replace them all at once bc one old one could damage any new ones.
i dunno if you have an advance auto close, but i got mine there with a lifetime warranty and took advantage of their coupons. a coupon for buy $50 save $20 or buy $100 save $40 <sometimes save $50 off $100 too> is the best way to go. break up the orders if need be, to use more than one coupon. i dunno the current coupon code, but if you search slickdeals.net for advance auto you will find the coupons i described.
the advance auto coils are by bwd/intermotor <it might be 'bdw', i dont recall>.. but anyways theyre made in usa, have a lifetime warranty, and are like less than half the price of the motorcraft/visteon/oem ones, which are no warranty and chinese... i have the bdw/intermotor ones from advance in my ls, an 05 v6, with zero issues. i wouldnt imagine they are much much diff v8-v6. i would caution against getting any brand other than the bwd/intermotor or the motorcraft/visteon or other brands that come recommended by someone successfully running them here bc you could be throwing money away. personally, i say stay away from motorcraft/visteon/oem bc they are known to fail around 60k, so obviously they are KNOWN to be somewhat subpar and expensive. might as well grab something with a warranty. plus the bwd/intermotors are usa mfr vs motorcraft/visteon/oem being china mfr... thats almost a no brainer to me.
but back to your question, how much does a maf play into 'it'?? who knows... your issue isnt 100% clear. 'fuel smell', 'hard start', and 'lower mpg than expected'... are you sure its an abnormal fuel smell? what exactly do you mean by 'hard start'? obviously it did start, so what is the idle rough or something? 'low mpg' these cars typically get worse mpg than listed on the epa sticker... how many mpg are you generally talking abt?
so youre issues maybe leaning towards normal... no way to know for sure over the internet. my cheap guesses would be clean the MAF, change the fuel filter, and run injector cleaner. if your problems are overstated then the 3 of those should cure it. i think your problems are overstated bc you dont have a code or a significant issue when driving the car such as hesitate/poor shifting/wrench light/other check engine light worthy symptoms. if it were running rich i would imagine you would have a code for that as well.
so yea the others are probably right to say coils.. but there are a few other things you need to do anyways <maf, fuel filter, injector cleaner>, so you might as well do those first before you throw the coils at it...
and fwiw, to the ppl being useless twd the new ppl... this guy has a motor with 89k... no matter the price tag why the fck would you scrap it?? get real. if he had 289k then youre maybe in the ballpark with that comment.... then the ppl who are sayign blah blah def coils go search etc... he doesnt have any other typical failing coil symptoms described... no missing, no hesitating, no wrench light, no check engine light, etc.
he may be a new guy, but his questions are 100% legit. if you dont like it dont read/comment... pretty easy...
Thank you. Very much appreciated. Scrap it ? Yeah right, gtfo seriously. Jeezus. Anyway, At cold start, it fires up as normal. After running to temp and warm start, it cranks for maybe 3-4 sec. then fires up. It's obvious there's a fuel issue & whether or not it's coils I can't say honestly. It seems to run fine, I have noticed some very slight misses between 30 - 40 mph. Shifts fine. No leaks anywhere, engine & engine bay are relatively clean of any oils or fluids. I believe car has been taken pretty good care of considering how nice interior is.
Ok will put on list. Thanks.
gotcha. yea i probably wouldnt throw coils at it first, but dont be shocked if you end up having to do it in the next few months if its missing... based on that cold-warm start blurb i would check the ECT coolant temp sensor bc that could be broke/disconnected. it might be thinking the motor is cold when its actually warm and dumping fuel in it...
Ok thanks.
G-RELL
FULLY DIPPED LS
Give it more than 5 months membership and see how you feel about answering these threads everyday, slick.... When new members refuse to review stickys, or search google for similar issues, it brings down this forum a bit each time...
That said, its a moot point by now. LVC is just a repair forum now a days... Maybe I can convince Joey of starting a new section called NON repair posts...
Best of luck to the OP and congrats on not getting your panties in a bunch with a little "light humor".
+1 on the fuel filter, and the advice of every thread related about COP/plugs... and i'll add possible air leaks ( coincidentally can be located with a little carb cleaner)
roncoinc
Well-Known LVC Member
Now here was your response.
" The LS has coils? wtf!?!?! why? "
I have read..
I have searched.
I have found that YOU do know some good stuff .
when searching "stuff" i have found you presented some VERY usefull info !
so "why" sometimes do you spend as much time berating and demeaning when in the same amount of time you could be helpful ??
you have so much to share with your experience and knowledge you could make learning SO much easier for people not familiar with the car or forum.
do you not want to help ?
do you not want to share ??
if i did not think you such an asset to this forum i would let it ride and say nothing,,,BUT i have seen what you can do and think you should be more forthcoming .
open up man ,,share !!
not everybody is a computer guru ,,know how to format search terms to get best results,etc.
YOU may be able to save somebody a lot of money and time,,that is a substantial reward for little time spent.
1LoudLS
Dedicated LVC Member
so lets take the spoon feeding and lack of searching part out of this...
so if anybody on here is to help out and answer certain ultra common questions. they then have to go back and do the searching for themselves, where it bites us in the ass, is every time a new thread asking the same questions as the two threads from last week or the 4 threads from the week before....... is that now these extra threads are clogging up the results, so the new people who are just starting to search have to wade through 70 useless threads just to find the 10-20 perfect threads that also exist, and they are just going to give up, start another thread, and continue to make the problem worse. not to mention now for each person that wants to help, it now takes them longer to find the tread they want so when you're doing the same thing a lot of times during the week and each time it takes longer and longer, sooner or later it just becomes easier to not help.
so if anybody on here is to help out and answer certain ultra common questions. they then have to go back and do the searching for themselves, where it bites us in the ass, is every time a new thread asking the same questions as the two threads from last week or the 4 threads from the week before....... is that now these extra threads are clogging up the results, so the new people who are just starting to search have to wade through 70 useless threads just to find the 10-20 perfect threads that also exist, and they are just going to give up, start another thread, and continue to make the problem worse. not to mention now for each person that wants to help, it now takes them longer to find the tread they want so when you're doing the same thing a lot of times during the week and each time it takes longer and longer, sooner or later it just becomes easier to not help.
roncoinc
Well-Known LVC Member
I am over five YEARS on a repair forum.
seen the circle go round a few times.
if your a member and don't answer the redundant questions why are you here ?? slick..??
do you think there will be NEW questions ?? LOL !!!
why not put up a few more FAQ's and close the forum to post's .
then you wont be bothered.
Or,,,not read the post's ..
Or,, not respond..
Or,,show us how you changed the color of your peel and stick paint job !! LOL !!!
on my forum when a new member comes in with the same old SOS i find it satisfying to guide them to find what they need and see the help they get result in that member getting more proficient in the subject and growing in knowledge and experience.
then when enthused they learn more and then go on to help a new batch of new members.
the forum covers equipment from 1926 to present and has over 56 THOUSAND members and growing every day.
roncoinc
Well-Known LVC Member
If you want to take the easy way out,,that's your choice.
but don't take glee in making somebody look foolish,,makes you look the same way. ( not referring to you specifically )..
if it's to much work don't put yourself out man..
" constructive " replies are the most helpful ones.
Let's all be friendly and helpful here !
we all have a common interest .
tolerance and understanding of others lack of strengths can help bolster our own.
no forum is perfect but if you like it foster it and help it grow through help and understanding.
i think sometimes a little more tolerance could be used.