Automatic Trans Flush...NOW Problems?

jagerme911

jagerme911

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2002 LS V8, I took her in for a trans flush @ 100k. Picked her up and everything SEEMED fine. About two days went bye, only put approx. 80 miles on her! Driving in D4 and came to somewhat of a quick stop, pushed the gas and the RPMs went up but didn't go anywhere! Seemed to be in neutral? Indicator said D4. Pressed the break then the gas, away she went. Parked her for the night. The next day, driving to work. Again had to come to somewhat of a quick stop and same exact thing? Been driving Her like a BABY SEEMS OK? Taking her back to the Lincoln Dealer Monday!!!! ANY IDEAS WTF????
 
when was the last time u did a flush other than this one. Sometimes if u never flush the tranny and then u decide to at 100k the tranny doesnt like that.
 
Your trans is LOW on fluid,trust me. When you hit the brakes hard you are forcing the fluid away from the pickup. It then sucks up air and neutrals out, then when you sit it comes back to the pickup and the trans reprimes and goes. When mine was 2.5 Qrts low after engine swap,it did this. Have it topped off.
 
Right on the Mark said:
Your trans is LOW on fluid,trust me. When you hit the brakes hard you are forcing the fluid away from the pickup. It then sucks up air and neutrals out, then when you sit it comes back to the pickup and the trans reprimes and goes. When mine was 2.5 Qrts low after engine swap,it did this. Have it topped off.
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+1 same year, same mileage, same issue, was low fluid b/c lincoln did not put a dipstick on the tranny for the dealer to check.
 
LongIslandLSE said:
when was the last time u did a flush other than this one. Sometimes if u never flush the tranny and then u decide to at 100k the tranny doesnt like that.
Click to expand...

That's a myth that was never true.

The OP's problem is that they did the flush wrong. Clearly, he is low on fluid and should get that corrected ASAP.
 
joegr said:
That's a myth that was never true.

The OP's problem is that they did the flush wrong. Clearly, he is low on fluid and should get that corrected ASAP.
Click to expand...

Admittedly, the OP's problem IS low fluid.

But the other issue discussed is not a myth.

What can happen over time with an auto tranny (and it's very tight tolerances) that has never had a service, is that sediment or "gunk" can tend to build up within the transmission over tens of thousands of miles. As long as that old fluid remains in place, often nothing will happen and the tranny will continue to operate just fine.

However, FLUSHING an older tranny using clean, fresh fluid with new, fresh, strong detergents being forced via pressure through the tranny can potentially cause smaller pieces of sediment/sludge/gunk to dislodge, bypass the filter, and begin to clog up tiny passages where ATF usually flows freely. If a critical passage gets completely clogged, ATF wont reach critical parts of the transmission, resulting in a tranny overheat situation, resulting in quick death of the transmission.

To avoid this, on older transmissions with lots of miles, it's best to avoid a complete flush, and just drop the pan, change the filter, replace the fluid thats just in the pan, and then drive. This method introduces less chance of gunk breaking off and clogging the passages.
 
lseguy said:
Admittedly, the OP's problem IS low fluid.

But the other issue discussed is not a myth.

What can happen over time with an auto tranny (and it's very tight tolerances) that has never had a service, is that sediment or "gunk" can tend to build up within the transmission over tens of thousands of miles. As long as that old fluid remains in place, often nothing will happen and the tranny will continue to operate just fine.

However, FLUSHING an older tranny using clean, fresh fluid with new, fresh, strong detergents being forced via pressure through the tranny can potentially cause smaller pieces of sediment/sludge/gunk to dislodge, bypass the filter, and begin to clog up tiny passages where ATF usually flows freely. If a critical passage gets completely clogged, ATF wont reach critical parts of the transmission, resulting in a tranny overheat situation, resulting in quick death of the transmission.

To avoid this, on older transmissions with lots of miles, it's best to avoid a complete flush, and just drop the pan, change the filter, replace the fluid thats just in the pan, and then drive. This method introduces less chance of gunk breaking off and clogging the passages.
Click to expand...

+1 i will not touch a tranny over 100k that comes in for a flush unless the owner signs our waiver saying they understand that we are not responsible for the tranny if it fails after, however the issue he is describing is a low fluid issue check it hot after you shift through reverse and drive check running and in neutral or park although im sure you already knew that lol :D
 
lseguy said:
Admittedly, the OP's problem IS low fluid.

But the other issue discussed is not a myth.

What can happen over time with an auto tranny (and it's very tight tolerances) that has never had a service, is that sediment or "gunk" can tend to build up within the transmission over tens of thousands of miles. As long as that old fluid remains in place, often nothing will happen and the tranny will continue to operate just fine.

However, FLUSHING an older tranny using clean, fresh fluid with new, fresh, strong detergents being forced via pressure through the tranny can potentially cause smaller pieces of sediment/sludge/gunk to dislodge, bypass the filter, and begin to clog up tiny passages where ATF usually flows freely. If a critical passage gets completely clogged, ATF wont reach critical parts of the transmission, resulting in a tranny overheat situation, resulting in quick death of the transmission.

To avoid this, on older transmissions with lots of miles, it's best to avoid a complete flush, and just drop the pan, change the filter, replace the fluid thats just in the pan, and then drive. This method introduces less chance of gunk breaking off and clogging the passages.
Click to expand...

Sorry, but I still say that is bunk. Do you have any direct personal experience with this?
Here's how it works. Someone goes too long between transmission fluid changes. (BTW, the interval for the LS is 150K miles) Their transmission starts to act up just a little, so they decide to get the fluid changed. They do the fluid change, but it doesn't help and the transmission goes on to fail. It failed because it had a problem that a simple fluid change couldn't solve, not because the fluid was finally changed. They tear down the transmission and see all the gunk everywhere and still blame the fluid change. The truth was that the transmission was going to fail within a few miles anyway. It had already given warning.
A fluid "flush" done correctly is no more stressful than a pan drop. It just exchanges old fluid with new fluid at the normal flow rate of the transmission. "Flush" is misnamed.
 
+1 I agree Joe.
more times than not people put off fluid changes until its "far too late".
Then they go flush the trans because it "started acting stupid".

then when it fails they blame the flush not the original issue prologned neglect of the trans.

Shops will claim the "dont change the fluid" story because the customer perceives one thing and actual fact is another thing.

it's easier to "repeat a rumor or falsehood" that the customer will "believe" than it is to educate the customer.
 
joegr said:
Sorry, but I still say that is bunk. Do you have any direct personal experience with this?
Here's how it works. Someone goes too long between transmission fluid changes. (BTW, the interval for the LS is 150K miles) Their transmission starts to act up just a little, so they decide to get the fluid changed. They do the fluid change, but it doesn't help and the transmission goes on to fail. It failed because it had a problem that a simple fluid change couldn't solve, not because the fluid was finally changed. They tear down the transmission and see all the gunk everywhere and still blame the fluid change. The truth was that the transmission was going to fail within a few miles anyway. It had already given warning.
A fluid "flush" done correctly is no more stressful than a pan drop. It just exchanges old fluid with new fluid at the normal flow rate of the transmission. "Flush" is misnamed.
Click to expand...


No, I do not have personal experience. But even if I did, it would just be antecedotal "evidence". My comments come from conversations with the owner (Lothar) of a long time DC area BMW specialty shop called "Excluservice" in Rockville, MD in addition to a conversation I had with a known local guy called Pat Goss (also of PBS's Motorweek fame). (Pat has a shop in Seabrook, MD..not far from me where I've had service done before.) And thats also in addition to an article I read in an edition of Motor Trend from about 2-3 years ago, and in a conversation I had with the service Manager of Academy Ford (who did my LS flush at 75k miles). All 4 sources said the same thing.

Hey..all 4 could be wrong. Its possible. ;)
 
Can we actually go that long (150k miles) w/o flushing? I just had my old 98 Cavalier flushed at 110k (was also flushed ~38k and 3 years ago) and I noticed a definite improvement.
 
WhoBeDaPlaya said:
Can we actually go that long (150k miles) w/o flushing? I just had my old 98 Cavalier flushed at 110k (was also flushed ~38k and 3 years ago) and I noticed a definite improvement.
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Its a sealed trans. Lots of people believe that since its a sealed you shouldnt even mess with it. At least thats what I read here.

Is that true?


I got a trans service a few years ago and my trans acted up a bit more. Never neglected it either so now I dont ever wanna do it again going by what I have read before.
 
For good or bad, mine has been flushed twice since her in-service date. Once at 20k (before I had it) and I flushed it once at 60k.
First flush was accompanied by solenoid replacement, second was accompanied by a PCM flash to "newer software". Both exhibited symptoms described in associated TSBs.

Seems to be doing great so far with 85k on her now. I hope to see another 75k before letting her go.
 
JWerner2 said:
Its a sealed trans. Lots of people believe that since its a sealed you shouldnt even mess with it. At least thats what I read here.
Is that true?
I got a trans service a few years ago and my trans acted up a bit more. Never neglected it either so now I dont ever wanna do it again going by what I have read before.
Click to expand...
Oh snap! I did do a flush on my old 01LSsport (used Valvoline synth ATF). Maybe that explained the hard shift into D5 when it started up.
 
Right on the Mark said:
Your trans is LOW on fluid,trust me. When you hit the brakes hard you are forcing the fluid away from the pickup. It then sucks up air and neutrals out, then when you sit it comes back to the pickup and the trans reprimes and goes. .
Click to expand...

This just happened to my explorer:rolleyes:
 
n8bachelor said:
For good or bad, mine has been flushed twice since her in-service date. Once at 20k (before I had it) and I flushed it once at 60k.
First flush was accompanied by solenoid replacement, second was accompanied by a PCM flash to "newer software". Both exhibited symptoms described in associated TSBs.

Seems to be doing great so far with 85k on her now. I hope to see another 75k before letting her go.
Click to expand...

I forgot about the flash, getting that is a must!
 
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