Disappointing presidential silence about illicit drugs
- Thread starter JohnnyBz00LS
- Start date
Bryan,
You've hijacked it again. I didn't say that Bush lied in this case. He just didn't tell the truth. If Bush were not a stupid liar how could he as "Annointed One" have been stupid enough to not just tell the truth. Maybe the words I'm looking for are "bad liar" in this case.
It wasn't just the '60s, '70s and '80s. Pot has been around in the American culture for much longer. My parents answered honestly when asked about their useage. That was the early '40s. I'd be suprised if GWB's father hadn't tried a puff or two himself. Just guessing there.
You've hijacked it again. I didn't say that Bush lied in this case. He just didn't tell the truth. If Bush were not a stupid liar how could he as "Annointed One" have been stupid enough to not just tell the truth. Maybe the words I'm looking for are "bad liar" in this case.
It wasn't just the '60s, '70s and '80s. Pot has been around in the American culture for much longer. My parents answered honestly when asked about their useage. That was the early '40s. I'd be suprised if GWB's father hadn't tried a puff or two himself. Just guessing there.
Styles
Active LVC Member
barry2952 said:
Ok let me explain...
Since the liberals have taken control of the government, the size of the US federal gov has grown, not shrunk, increased the national debt, cut our armed forces and passing more pork under their watch than anybody else in history. Liberlas believe in "tax and spend", "big gov is the answer" type policies.
Conservatives basically want as little Government intervention as possible. In other words, liberals will support a tax to rectify whatever major or minor social ill they hope to remedy: the environment and obesity are popular amongst them. Hey global climate maybe possibly changing, maybe possibly due to greenhouse gases? Tax hell out of gasoline and carbon. We'll definitely wreck the economy, but if we're lucky the environment might possibly improve enough to raise our self-esteem two percent.
Styles
Active LVC Member
barry2952 said:
as the good Dr. Phil would say...
I listen way too much to Bob & Tom in the morrnings, since Dr. Phil has been the running joke for the past week.
15 mins I jump in my LS v8 sport and leave work woooohooo
:Beer
MonsterMark
Dedicated LVC Member
barry2952 said:
Heck, for the Dems and liberals out there, it is fine to have a pot-smoking (I did not inhale), wife-cheating (I did not have sexual relations with THAT woman), ball swinging (I prefer boxers to briefs), friend murdering (all my friends die mysteriously it seems), saxophone playing perp in the White House. What is wrong with children looking up to the most powerful man in the world without dragging all the dirty laundry out? Bush's responses were well thought out and appropriate.
I will continue to defend our President at every turn until he finishes his term in the White House. He has restored dignity and class that was sorely missing for 8 previous years that a Dem occupied the Office.
MonsterMark
Dedicated LVC Member
Bob and Tom are great. Funny as h e-double L.Styles said:
And Phil is another member of the board, not the quack Dr.
JohnnyBz00LS
Dedicated LVC Member
Styles said:
Care to share whatever that is you're smoking?
JohnnyBz00LS
Dedicated LVC Member
MonsterMark said:
So you LIKE the idea of slavery, eh?
MonsterMark
Dedicated LVC Member
Oh, absolutely. My business helped to raise of generation of Latinos (Mexican/Americans). I gave good jobs to mom, dad, sis, cousin, grandma. It didn't matter. No discrimination. If you showed up and wanted to work, you could. 6 or 7 would pile into a car, drive 20 miles and be promptly at work at 6:00. They would work 50-60 hours if needed to (overtime, of course). Lived 6-10 to a household and shared the living expenses. Sent wads of cash back down to Mexico so they could buy and build homes with the money they earned in the US. Now I paid way over minimum wage but back home in Mexico, if they made $.50-75/hr, they were lucky. Slavery? I bet you couldn't get one of them to say they were a slave. A couple of employees even bestowed the honor of naming their kids after me.JohnnyBz00LS said:
Slavery??? I laugh. How far have we come when not even 70 years ago, I person would work all day just to get something to eat. And look at 80% of the worlds population. Do you really think any of them would think that being in America and getting paid $5.15/hr would be considered slavery? Kidding right? Or, if you're not, you don't get out much.
JohnnyBz00LS said:
Please correct me if I am wrong, but I believe that Ike, Nixon and Ford were republicans. This would pretty much even the playing field.
Look at it this way,
911 happened
This messed up the economy big time,
Then all of the debacles about Enron and other companies.
Hence, Government needs to start spending.
Also, why do you think the deficit was so high at the beginning of that chart.
FDR the biggest lib of them all.
Although arguably the greatest president of all time, he did drive the deficit up because of the market crash as well as the war.
Just look upon GW as a mini FDR, only with more well thought out programs for social security construction.
TownCar97
Styles
Active LVC Member
JohnnyBz00LS said:
Cute Grph considering it only shows GDP (narrow minded if you ask me) And if I dared to share what ever I smoke you just might see MIB in black helicopters over your house.
Now for some real numbers not from just one source
look at the peak spending under Bush Sr. 431,989,899,919.78, and the least spending under Clinton, 17,907,308,271.43. That's 4%, or a 1 to 24 ratio. Interesting huh
compare this with Employment for the same period to see if any correlation can be made.
While it may be tempting to think government deficit spending influences employment, the opposite is likely true - the more people who are employed, the more revenue the government gets through taxes.
The Consumer Price Index measures inflation. It tracks the price of goods (bread, milk, etc.) over time. This particular chart uses 1967 as it's base year (100 points). This is a sort of cost-of-living index. Looking at this chart, you can infer that you need to make around 5.5 times more money now than you did in 1967 to live the same type of lifestyle.
National Debt, Adjusted for Inflation
First I calculated the Consumer Price Index to use 1950 as it's base year. Then, using the Consumer Price Index (CPI) I calculated the national debt to take into account inflation (Debt/CPI).
In 1950's dollars, our debt is currently $887,445,036,515.72 or 887 billion dollars, which is 3.45 times the size of the debt in 1950.
Here's just the inflation-adjusted debt from 1950 - 2003. This graph paints a very interesting picture about the past few administrations.
notice the years there spanky
Gross Domestic Product, or GDP is a measure of all of the goods and services produced within the United States. It differs from the Consumer Price Index in that this measures what we produce (and we can infer, consume), versus the cost of living. So while everyone can have a flat screen TV and an SUV (high GDP), the Consumer Price Index is the cost of living - bread, milk, and so on.
Gross Domestic Product, 1930 - 2003
To put the whole debt thing in perspective, here's the Gross Domestic Product (GDP) for the USA from 1930 to the present. Luckily, our growth actually has been a "hockey stick" and looking at this graph, the debt starts to seem somewhat more rational. There's simply more money floating around.
In 1946 The debt hit 121.7% of the GDP due to WWII, it's currently (as of 2003) at 62.4%.
hmmmmmmm
Sources of Information
* Budget of the United States Goverment
*
o Budget of the United States Government, Fiscal Year 2005
o
+ Historical Tables
This site has lots of information on the past budgets.
o Joint Economic Committe Study "Budget Surpluses, Deficits and Government Spending"
* The US Government's Debt
*
o
Bureau of the Public Debt
This is where I got all my debt information, and they have
o
+
The Debt to the Penny and Who Holds It
current "debt clock"
+ U.S. Treasury - FAQs: National Debt.
o The CIA World Factbook - United States
Has lots of information about the USA, including the External Debt.
* Population estimates
*
o Population Estimates Archive
To get the number of people in the US.
o US Population Clock
Up to the minute population estimates.
* Employment & Unemployment Rates
*
*
o Bureau of Labor Statistics Current Population Survey Homepage
o
+ Employment status of civilian noninstituational population, 1940 to date
*
Gross Domestic Product
*
o Bureau of Economic Analysis: National Economic Accounts
This site has the current GDP
o
+ Bureau of Economic Analysis - Historic Gross Domestic Product estimates
o Joint Economic Committee Study "Budget Surpluses, Deficits and Government Spending"
* The Consumer Price Index (Inflation)
*
o Consumer Price Index
o
+ U.S. All Items, 1967=100
* The Value of Gold
*
o World Gold Council > value > research & statistics > homepage
Other Interesting Links
* U.S. public debt (Wikipedia)
* Federal Spending and the National Debt
This site has an interesting graph on How Congress Spend Your Money
* In Depth Analysis of American Income and Taxation
An excellent look at what it truly means to be in the "top 1% of wealth" and how much is paid in taxes by them, oh, and everyone else too.
* Central Bankers Against Gold - The Demonisation of Gold 1933-1980
This website describes rather succinctly the events that led up to the abolition of the debt ceiling that allowed us to reach our current levels of debt. It's somewhat biased.
* A History of the U.S. Debt Ceiling - 1940 to Present
A good chart outlining when Congress raised the debt ceiling.
* Individual Tax Statistics - Time Series (IRS.gov)
* Centrists.Org: Where Will the Deficit Go From Here? New Long-Term Budget Projections
* U.S. Budget Information
This site has lots of interesting information on money in America covering everything from consumer debt to economic indicators to foreign trade.
* Death and Taxes: A visual look at where your tax dollars go.
This is the single best chart of where money is being spent that I've seen online.
JohnnyBz00LS
Dedicated LVC Member
Sorry Barry, I was taking issue w/ Styles' errant remark ("Since the liberals have taken control of the government, [they] .......... increased the national debt......"), which he so eloquently helped prove was not true.
Style's first graph just further emphasizes my point, which is that he is WRONG about liberals increasing the national debt. Clinton (the only liberal president in my voting years) turned around the debt racked-up by 3 terms of Reganomics, then in LESS THAN 4 YEARS, BuSh Jr. blows it all and then some!
His 2nd graph helps emphasize the fact that employment was at an all time high during Clinton, only to be turned around by BuSh Jr.
His 3rd graph is nice info.
His 4th graph again illustrates that Reaganomics caused the most substantial growth in adjusted debt, and it was during Clinton's term that the growth in adjusted debt was turned around and headed back in the right direction, only to be BLOWN by BuSh Jr.
The 5th graph shows that GDP is pretty much a function of our growing working population and inflation, that's nice.
The 6th graph is the same as the graph I posted, debt as a % of GDP. So he apparently concludes that he was wrong in his assertion as well.
*owned*
Style's first graph just further emphasizes my point, which is that he is WRONG about liberals increasing the national debt. Clinton (the only liberal president in my voting years) turned around the debt racked-up by 3 terms of Reganomics, then in LESS THAN 4 YEARS, BuSh Jr. blows it all and then some!
His 2nd graph helps emphasize the fact that employment was at an all time high during Clinton, only to be turned around by BuSh Jr.
His 3rd graph is nice info.
His 4th graph again illustrates that Reaganomics caused the most substantial growth in adjusted debt, and it was during Clinton's term that the growth in adjusted debt was turned around and headed back in the right direction, only to be BLOWN by BuSh Jr.
The 5th graph shows that GDP is pretty much a function of our growing working population and inflation, that's nice.
The 6th graph is the same as the graph I posted, debt as a % of GDP. So he apparently concludes that he was wrong in his assertion as well.
*owned*
MonsterMark
Dedicated LVC Member
barry2952 said:
There is nothing worthy to comment on because nobody is disappointed with President Bush's comment about past drug use. He handled the question better than previous Presidents, VP's and other Presidential contenders.
I can always move all the comments regarding the gdp and national debt into another thread if you guys want.
That way we can keep this a Bash Bush thread as it was intended.
eL eS
Dedicated LVC Member
OK what I learned from this is that it is ok for liberals to take my money and give it to a baby poppin crack head but not ok to support my family and secure this country!
JohnnyBz00LS
Dedicated LVC Member
eL eS said:
WTF are you talking about? Forget to take your meds?