I am young and inexperienced, but willing to learn, so dont be surprised if I ask somewhat obvious questions. But people say the ls is underpowered, if you want more hp, couldnt you replace the injectors with bigger ones, and a bigger fuel pump to accommodate the need for more gas. Im sure you would lose mpg, but if you want power? The injectors arent terribly expensive....
Extra hp?
- Thread starter The ls ss
- Start date
FDR
Dedicated LVC Member
You need more air to burn the extra fuel. Otherwise, it'll just run rich. The PCM will read the richness and reduce the injector pulse length, negating the increased size of the injectors. If it can't reduce it enough, it'll continue to run rich without extra power. It's possible a tune could make it run right, but you'll still likely be air-limited. It's certainly something to explore if you went with a power adder, but I'd think you'd be best off waiting for confirmation it's running lean first
Of course, I'm always in the "while I'm there" and "may as well upgrade" camps, which is why a dragging brake turned into an StR swap. I'd consider an upgrade if I had a failed injector, but definitely wouldn't do it out of the blue
I don't know if those injectors would fit correctly. The nozzle on the factory injectors are longer. Our injectors are unique to the LS and Thunderbird, but I can't find specs on what exactly is unique
The purple injector's page also lists a bunch of possible connectors they could have. You could probably figure something out with a bunch of different injectors on hand
LS injector:
M9593 page: FORD RACING 24 LB/HR FUEL INJECTOR SET
Of course, I'm always in the "while I'm there" and "may as well upgrade" camps, which is why a dragging brake turned into an StR swap. I'd consider an upgrade if I had a failed injector, but definitely wouldn't do it out of the blue
I don't know if those injectors would fit correctly. The nozzle on the factory injectors are longer. Our injectors are unique to the LS and Thunderbird, but I can't find specs on what exactly is unique
The purple injector's page also lists a bunch of possible connectors they could have. You could probably figure something out with a bunch of different injectors on hand
LS injector:
M9593 page: FORD RACING 24 LB/HR FUEL INJECTOR SET
thahn1608
New LVC Member
I read an old post (2006 ish) on here about a guy adding up to 7psi from the turbo and keeping the stock fuel pump and injectors. He claimed that the fuel pressure didn't drop off, but then again he did fry the bearings apparently from a bad tune... *shrug*
I'm only 3 weeks in to having an LS, but I'm learning all the common issues to BOLO. I find the stock has adequate power to chirp the wheels at launch and set you back in the seat from 50-70mph. It's enough for me - for now. Much better than my other turbo non-V8 car.
I'm only 3 weeks in to having an LS, but I'm learning all the common issues to BOLO. I find the stock has adequate power to chirp the wheels at launch and set you back in the seat from 50-70mph. It's enough for me - for now. Much better than my other turbo non-V8 car.
Yeah, I figured the lack of extra air would be the biggest problem. I have seen people who did it to cars, but the cars were tuboed. I agree that the ls has good enough power for me, I was curious why the guy who drag races his ls did not do the injector upgrade, or if it is possible..
On a side note, I would like a k&n air intake on my car, but I can only find air filters for a '02 ls v8, not the entire set up. Would a '03 ls k&n fit my '02? If not, are there any other good brands of air intakes out there? I would like a little extra horse, better sound, and a better look under the hood.
And Im only 3 months into owning as ls, but I have done some mods and hope to continue.
On a side note, I would like a k&n air intake on my car, but I can only find air filters for a '02 ls v8, not the entire set up. Would a '03 ls k&n fit my '02? If not, are there any other good brands of air intakes out there? I would like a little extra horse, better sound, and a better look under the hood.
And Im only 3 months into owning as ls, but I have done some mods and hope to continue.
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04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
The LS is no slouch. Granted... the Gen 1 has less hp... but at 280hp the gen 2 isn't far from some of the Corvettes 9f yesteryear.
Believe it or not... about a month ago... I eeeked out a win against a Coyote Mustang. Granted... the sun, moon, stars, (and planets), had to line up... but I got him by a fenders length.
This was with a bone stock LS that has almost 230k miles on the odometer.
Cold air intake kits, tunes, and exhaust upgrades... are readily available. Some have looked into throttle body swaps. The more knowledgeable have done turbos or superchargers.
However... before you start modding your LS... you will want to make sure the basic mechanicals are solid... such as timing chains, oil pump pressure, transmission function... and of course... a proper functioning cooling system.
Modding the LS before the mechanicals are solid... is making a silk purse out of a sows ear.
Believe it or not... about a month ago... I eeeked out a win against a Coyote Mustang. Granted... the sun, moon, stars, (and planets), had to line up... but I got him by a fenders length.
This was with a bone stock LS that has almost 230k miles on the odometer.
Cold air intake kits, tunes, and exhaust upgrades... are readily available. Some have looked into throttle body swaps. The more knowledgeable have done turbos or superchargers.
However... before you start modding your LS... you will want to make sure the basic mechanicals are solid... such as timing chains, oil pump pressure, transmission function... and of course... a proper functioning cooling system.
Modding the LS before the mechanicals are solid... is making a silk purse out of a sows ear.
I assume that means taking it to a mechanic or dealer and having them check everything? Them owner before me seems to have kept up on all maintenance, the trans shifts nicely, havent had the temp go above half, haven't had any check engine lights. I prefer to do as much work as I can by myself, is there a way to do a check on these, or should I just go dealer/ mechanic?
My ls has 170,xxx
I'm impressed you beat a coyote mustang, very nice.
My ls has 170,xxx
I'm impressed you beat a coyote mustang, very nice.
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
At this point in the LS life cycle, the dealer is rarely the right place to go. You'd probably have better luck at a Jaguar dealer, but that wouldn't be my first pick either. You really need to be able to do most of the work yourself for owning an LS to make much sense now. Find some good independent shops with LS/Jaguar experience for the things that you can't do (or are unwilling to do).
The LS really isn't like any other Ford/Lincoln car. When it was new, the dealers had freshly trained mechanics to work on it. Now, they rarely know any more about the car than anyone else does.
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
Please don't take what I am about to say... the wrong way.
If your mechanical experience is lacking... and your solution is to have work done by someone else... then the LS is going to prove to be a very expensive car for you to own.
Many independent shops don't know how to properly work on the LS... and the Dealer as an alternative will be cost prohibitive. Even some of the dealers can be a bit sketchy.
From some of your posts... you already are having issues with your cooling system. THAT alone... is about a $1000 commitment with dealer only parts... and that's IF you do the work YOURSELF.
The LS does not like most aftermarket parts. Many people on this forum have tried... and found out the hard way.
I'm not trying to discourage you... but just giving you a "reality check"... and you're not the first person to "jump in with both feet.
If your mechanical experience is lacking... and your solution is to have work done by someone else... then the LS is going to prove to be a very expensive car for you to own.
Many independent shops don't know how to properly work on the LS... and the Dealer as an alternative will be cost prohibitive. Even some of the dealers can be a bit sketchy.
From some of your posts... you already are having issues with your cooling system. THAT alone... is about a $1000 commitment with dealer only parts... and that's IF you do the work YOURSELF.
The LS does not like most aftermarket parts. Many people on this forum have tried... and found out the hard way.
I'm not trying to discourage you... but just giving you a "reality check"... and you're not the first person to "jump in with both feet.
I agree with the dealers being expensive, and local mechanics often not knowing how to work on an ls. On the cooling issue, I topped the coolant off, and it heats better. I am used to the physical climate controls, so it could be that the computer makes the cabin heat slower than the cars where you have the three dials; fan speed, air temp, and where it blows. I dont know what it takes to be a cooling issue, but my car holds temp fine, gauge never passes half temp. Idk, again it could be I am not used to digital climate control.
I very much appreciate that you are making sure I dont go headfirst into this, and end up spending way too much money on the car.
On the mechanical experience, I am still learning, but I love to do work by myself, I hate to pay money for a fix when I can take the time and learn something.
I have mostly worked on atvs, rebuilding carbs, removing the rear axle, replacing rewinds.... I have done a bit on a car, helped with starter replacement.
The main reason I want to do mods is to get experience with cars. But I do very much agree that it isnt worth putting a bunch of money and work into a car that is gonna end up being a money hole.
I very much appreciate that you are making sure I dont go headfirst into this, and end up spending way too much money on the car.
On the mechanical experience, I am still learning, but I love to do work by myself, I hate to pay money for a fix when I can take the time and learn something.
I have mostly worked on atvs, rebuilding carbs, removing the rear axle, replacing rewinds.... I have done a bit on a car, helped with starter replacement.
The main reason I want to do mods is to get experience with cars. But I do very much agree that it isnt worth putting a bunch of money and work into a car that is gonna end up being a money hole.
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joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
Nope.
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
As an example... my center driveshaft support bearing is showing signs of age. Typical... about every 7 years to have to replace this, ( at least in my neck of the woods).
7 years ago... with my dealer discount... I bought one for roughly $110. That's with my dealer discount. 7 years later... the price has since risen too $300 list price. With my discount it was $225 OTD.
To replace the center driveshaft support bearing... is easily a 2 hour job for someone with experience. The back half of the exhaust has to be removed... along with the underbody heat sheild... just to see the driveshaft.
Then... all of the bolts and spacers at the rear coupler have to be marked... so that they can be installed back in the exact same place... otherwise there will be a ,(different), driveline vibration... that could cause damage to the differential.
The same indexing also has to be done at the center bearing support... because, ( IIRC ), they are of varying thickness for proper driveshaft alignment.
Then... once you get the driveshaft out, (after index marking both halves), the support bearing has to be cut with a dremel and split with a chisel... or pressed off.
Reassembly is reversed.
For an independent shop to do this, (with a cheap $70 aftermarket part that will not hold up as long), would probably be $300+ ... IF they knew what they were doing. Dealer would be EASILY double that.
7 years ago... with my dealer discount... I bought one for roughly $110. That's with my dealer discount. 7 years later... the price has since risen too $300 list price. With my discount it was $225 OTD.
To replace the center driveshaft support bearing... is easily a 2 hour job for someone with experience. The back half of the exhaust has to be removed... along with the underbody heat sheild... just to see the driveshaft.
Then... all of the bolts and spacers at the rear coupler have to be marked... so that they can be installed back in the exact same place... otherwise there will be a ,(different), driveline vibration... that could cause damage to the differential.
The same indexing also has to be done at the center bearing support... because, ( IIRC ), they are of varying thickness for proper driveshaft alignment.
Then... once you get the driveshaft out, (after index marking both halves), the support bearing has to be cut with a dremel and split with a chisel... or pressed off.
Reassembly is reversed.
For an independent shop to do this, (with a cheap $70 aftermarket part that will not hold up as long), would probably be $300+ ... IF they knew what they were doing. Dealer would be EASILY double that.
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
The computer doesn't make heat. The cooling system does. If you are lacking heat and topping off the cooling system... you have a leak... and to fix it properly is going to cost you close to $1000 for dealer parts... and your own labor. For the inexperienced... the cooling system rebuild has proven to be a PITA.
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
There is an older thread around here somewhere... where a (former?) member paid the dealer $1500 to do a partial cooling system replacement... then went back for further work at another $800 cost. Even then... not everything had been replaced.
IIRC... the factory degas bottle, (overflow bottle), retails for around $400. Don't know for sure, because I haven't paid full dealer price for parts in over 20 years.
IIRC... the factory degas bottle, (overflow bottle), retails for around $400. Don't know for sure, because I haven't paid full dealer price for parts in over 20 years.
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
Right here... is $500 in parts... at MY cost... and that's only about half if them.
I am very bad at assuming people know everything I do, and forgot to mention I topped it off after i bought it from sitting for a year. I bought it, took it home 3 months later on lvc someone mentioned topping off the coolant in the thermostat housing /fill cap.
I love this car, an I honestly dont want to put money in an eternal money guzzler, but I would like to keep running this car, so dont take this wrong, because you dont know me, but replacing the center driveshaft support bearing sounds like something I would be up for doing. I was raised on a farm, and my dad is good at fixing things. I may not have a lot of car experience, but I am used to hours of work on my atvs. And my dad is the car experience.
I am 16, so it could be my lack of knowledge, but I am up for a challenge, as long as it is decently cheap, and I am not going to wreck the car.
I mean no disrespect and appreciate the advice, and want to find the best option.
I love this car, an I honestly dont want to put money in an eternal money guzzler, but I would like to keep running this car, so dont take this wrong, because you dont know me, but replacing the center driveshaft support bearing sounds like something I would be up for doing. I was raised on a farm, and my dad is good at fixing things. I may not have a lot of car experience, but I am used to hours of work on my atvs. And my dad is the car experience.
I am 16, so it could be my lack of knowledge, but I am up for a challenge, as long as it is decently cheap, and I am not going to wreck the car.
I mean no disrespect and appreciate the advice, and want to find the best option.
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04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
Yeah... that's not gonna happen... to do it right. However... if you like doing things over and over... then go cheap.
Not trying to be a jerk... just letting you know what you are in for.
I suggest you search this forum for the numerous multiple cooling system threads.
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
You had to add coolant and you have a heating problem. You know that the cooling system is failing, you just don't want to believe it.
Pull the degas bottle out, you will see cracks.
Pull a hose off, the black plastic will look brown inside.
Be warned, do any of these things and parts may break completely, forcing you to replace them then and there. Do it like many have, and next week you will be replacing one of the other parts. This will continue till you get them all. Best and least expensive to do them all, now on your schedule.
You have a 1st gen (2000-2002), correct?
Cooling System 3.9L - 1st GEN Lincoln LS w/ PN's
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
^^^ x1000 
Not trying to be a jerk... just letting you know what you are in for.
I know you arent trying to be a jerk, and neither am I. Your advice is appreciated and helpful. You have much more experience than I.......
I know you arent trying to be a jerk, and neither am I. Your advice is appreciated and helpful. You have much more experience than I.......
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
The LS is not a money guzzler. It's just expensive to repair properly... and it requires REPEATED maintenace every several years.
If you do a proper, full cooling system rebuild now... you shouldn't have to touch it again for another 6-7 years... or roughly another 100k miles.
thahn1608
New LVC Member
So with mine being a 2002 LS with 3.9 - but only 39,000 miles am I in for a rebuild or should it get me a while yet? If they last 6-7 years then I'm toast. If they last 100k miles then I should be ok. I have no signs of any issues (leaks, heat, or refilling).
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
thahn,
Age OR milage can be a contributing factor. For me... it's milage... because I drive an average of 60-130 miles a day for work, (5-7 days a week).
Yours most likely has the original parts... due to low miles... but it is posiible that at least some parts have been replaced. Especially if you have the aluminum thermostat housing. The plastic parts might be a bit sketchy if they are truely 18 years old.
Signs of a leak are typically a drop in fluid level in the degas bottle... and hearing the radiator fan run at high speed without the A/C on. This is assuming that the hydraulic fan setup is working properly.
The fan running at high speed, (without A/C on), is an attempt by the computer to cool the engine due to sensing an overheat condition. The temp gauge in the car will not show the vehicle overheating... unless temps get critical.
Age OR milage can be a contributing factor. For me... it's milage... because I drive an average of 60-130 miles a day for work, (5-7 days a week).
Yours most likely has the original parts... due to low miles... but it is posiible that at least some parts have been replaced. Especially if you have the aluminum thermostat housing. The plastic parts might be a bit sketchy if they are truely 18 years old.
Signs of a leak are typically a drop in fluid level in the degas bottle... and hearing the radiator fan run at high speed without the A/C on. This is assuming that the hydraulic fan setup is working properly.
The fan running at high speed, (without A/C on), is an attempt by the computer to cool the engine due to sensing an overheat condition. The temp gauge in the car will not show the vehicle overheating... unless temps get critical.