got the new battery, car ran fine, but headlights, wipers etc went out...

[Aviation]

New battery in, car drive for 20 mins, didnt get really sluggish and slow like it was about to cut out like it did before, but when we got near my house, the headlights cut out...as the windshield wipers did, which was bad it was night and raining but made it home!

so i get home, lights aint working i look in the back the left light is on but not the right, really odd

i go inside, come out 5 mins later, it starts right up fine and the lights, wipers and everything else seemed to work fine again

but probably they would have randomly cut out after driving for a bit like they did on the way home

so the battery seems like it fixed part of the problem, but this other issue seems separate all together now

sound like anything familiar to anyone? anyone had the symptoms? its really puzzling...

 

[Aviation]

the battery light stayed on even after the new one was put in

what all is included in the charging system that could be messed up?

god im just hoping its a sensor or something simple, id hate to blow more money at the shop but im probably going to have to

also another little funny electrical thing that happened was when the lights went out on the way home, in the driveway they came back on and when i flicked the high beams the lights went out

i know you are all probably getting tired of hearing about this, but im trying to find out what it is to find a cheap fix hopefully before i take it to the shop, cuz i need to save up money depending what it will cost to take it in, so im trying to troubleshoot in the free time while im saving

the check engine light aint on so i guess i couldnt get any codes if i got a reader or something

 

[gordon gecko]

have you checked your fuses?

 

[Aviation]

i think so, i checked the box in the back i was actually missing like 3 fuses, but im sure its had to be like that, didnt have the book so couldn't see what they were to, guess i can replace them but i doubt that is it.

theres a box in the front i think too? my friend checked that one a few weeks back, was fine. so i can replace the missing few in the back

i dunno, could be a bad wire that got chewed or something

ignition coil? would that cause my symptoms

hmmmm

 

[Dacket]

Sounds to me like a bad ground...

 

[Outkast]

check all of the connections in the trunk too...definatly sound like a bad ground somewhere. Can you get it to autozone to do a alt test to see if it is charging?

 

[joegr]

check all of the connections in the trunk too...definatly sound like a bad ground somewhere. Can you get it to autozone to do a alt test to see if it is charging?

The red light on the dash that is on specifically means that it is not.
He's in over his head here. He is just going the kill the new battery while he is messing around.

 

[Aviation]

the battery light means its not a bad ground?

also the abs and traction control light on the dash will flash on and off

 

[02lincoln3.9]

Hey Aviation, I had the same problem in my 2002. Its a real pain in the ass. My lights went out and my gauges went from zero to max and back down. My car would run and drive fine but no electrical in the car would work. I put 3 new batteries in and 4 new alternators and still had the same problem. Charging light never went off. If you take a DMM and volt check the battery it should say charging 16 volts. almost like the alt is running free. The problem for me was 12 volt constant wire on the alt it self. I gave my car to a guy that worked for ford and he made a jumper wire from the plug on top of the alt to a constant 12 volt source. (just tied in to the battery wire) light went off car ran fine. Couldnt have been more happy with it and then number coil shut down so its back on the side of my house sitting there again. Hope this helps.

 

[Aviation]

wowww now im really angry. apparently the battery didnt fix the starting problem either, its been 1 day since i bought a brand new battery...now its too weak to start the car, gettin some clicking sounds and a real weak kick when i turn the key

what the hell!!!!!!!!!!??? does that mean my brand new battery is now ruined? something completely killed it in 1 day already? what the hell causes that? wow!!!

 

[Andrizzle]

yea something is constantly drawing your current... You need to just look at all the electrical stuff... any alarms or aftermarket remote starts or anything like that ever done to the car? maybe search around for previous owner's doings

 

[Aviation]

could a bad ignition coil cause the battery die like that?

im reading some symptoms and bad ignition coil is coming up a lot for my other symptoms

sound like a possibility to anyone?

 

[#1fordfan]

[QUOTE

what the hell!!!!!!!!!!??? does that mean my brand new battery is now ruined? something completely killed it in 1 day already? what the hell causes that? wow!!![/QUOTE]

the new battery should be fine.
A bad coil would not cause the battery to die, it's not either getting charged or something is drawing voltage after you are shutting the car off.
Good Luck

 

[joegr]

Okay, this is my last response to this thread.
You are wasting your money fooling around. I posted (a good while back) the troubleshooting chart for this problem. Clearly, you are unable or unwilling to follow it.
Keep doing what you are doing, just because it hasn't worked yet, doesn't mean it won't. Yes, your new battery is damaged. Either it is being grossly overcharged at 16 to 18 volts (which also causes it to vent hydrogen by the way), or you have let it go below 10V. Either way, it is permanently damaged, the only question is how badly.
Buy a few more new (but incorrect) batteries, put another alternator in, replace the coils, and change out the floor mats and report the results back. Add up what you spent on all that, and you could have taken it to even the dealer and spent less time and money. The difference would be that it would be fixed now.

 

[Aviation]

Okay, this is my last response to this thread.
You are wasting your money fooling around. I posted (a good while back) the troubleshooting chart for this problem. Clearly, you are unable or unwilling to follow it.
Keep doing what you are doing, just because it hasn't worked yet, doesn't mean it won't. Yes, your new battery is damaged. Either it is being grossly overcharged at 16 to 18 volts (which also causes it to vent hydrogen by the way), or you have let it go below 10V. Either way, it is permanently damaged, the only question is how badly.
Buy a few more new (but incorrect) batteries, put another alternator in, replace the coils, and change out the floor mats and report the results back. Add up what you spent on all that, and you could have taken it to even the dealer and spent less time and money. The difference would be that it would be fixed now.

stay out of my thread you lame duck.

I dont want your opinion, you egotistical, smart mouth little punk.

You see, other people in here are actually trying to help, you are just shooting your redneck mouth off, so DO NOT POST IN ANY OF MY THREADS

you got that? your replies are the most useless i have seen on this forum, you are one sad individual. How lame can you get? you need a girlfriend..or some form of human contact, dont come at me shooting your worthless mouth off because you are bitter at life.

 

[#1fordfan]

from Joegr's response, he does not sound like a smart mouth little punk.
I got the fix for you, drop a lit road flare in the trunk, video the carnage for Youtube, and then report the accident to your insurance company. sound like a win-win situation!!!!

 

[Aviation]

if you read his response from the other thread, he is being a smart ass, just like you are. Your attempt at humor failed, and a car forum isnt really the place to test out your failed career as a master of internet comedy.

From your first response you seemed like a respectable person, but you are just trying to jump on the bandwagon and ride joegr's nuts for cool points now. Very, very lame.

 

[Outkast]

I don't think he is...well he is, but because YOU asked for help, and he gave you a troubleshooting chart....way more than we gave you making gueses..

It would seem, since you blamed it on a coil of all things, that you did not follow the ts directions.

thats why he is being a smart ass...

you asked for help, he gave it, and you ingnored him....at least thats how it lookes from here.

 

[Aviation]

ok even if that is the case, why does he need to come in this thread and make a smart ass reply to me? Im not going to communicate with someone who acts like a 12 year old. He should simply stay out of my threads but im sure he isnt mature enough for that.

I was just trying to get a few ideas in case anyone else had the same symptoms as mine.

i didnt blame anything on a coil, i said i was searching the net and some of my same symptoms were associated with a bad coil.

 

[Outkast]

I hear ya, but I assure you, unless its packed with C-4 or mounted underneth, a coil can in no way, kill your headlights....ever

smart asses or not, with all do respect to GCwimmer, and quikls...Joe is the smartest dude on here...even if he is reading it from a book, he seems to always have an answer..(except to my no start issue )

anyway...somthing is draining your battery. there is a way to see with a digital multi meter...someone else will chime in I'm sure but....you connect it btween the bat and somthing else, and pull your fuses on at a time until the draw stops. maybe you can even use a test light, I really don't remember.

you definaly have a drain...yes you killed the battery, but if it is a decent one, it will still be ok if you charge it back up soon. don't let it keep going dead, that is not good for them.

without being there, its really hard to diagnose problems over the internet, like Joegr said, it may be time to give in an take it to a shop.

 

[Outkast]

if nothing else, they can diagnose the issue, then you can go home and fix it.

 

[Aviation]

I hear ya, but I assure you, unless its packed with C-4 or mounted underneth, a coil can in no way, kill your headlights....ever

smart asses or not, with all do respect to GCwimmer, and quikls...Joe is the smartest dude on here...even if he is reading it from a book, he seems to always have an answer..(except to my no start issue )

anyway...somthing is draining your battery. there is a way to see with a digital multi meter...someone else will chime in I'm sure but....you connect it btween the bat and somthing else, and pull your fuses on at a time until the draw stops. maybe you can even use a test light, I really don't remember.

you definaly have a drain...yes you killed the battery, but if it is a decent one, it will still be ok if you charge it back up soon. don't let it keep going dead, that is not good for them.

without being there, its really hard to diagnose problems over the internet, like Joegr said, it may be time to give in an take it to a shop.

yes most likely im going to take it to a shop, im just waiting for another check to have a little more cash on hand since i have no idea what its going to cost, another reason why im trying to figure out the problem.

ok so i guess ill kill the coil theory, because the lights did shut off, as well as the wipers and electric windows

and thats all well and good he is smart and good at diagnosing problems, but he has been nothing but a smart ass, forum elitist prick to me and i dont take disrespect in real life, or behind a monitor so i really dont want his help if hes going to act in that manner, sure id like his opinions if he is knowledgeable as you say, but not with the way he is acting, he expects to be treated like a king i guess, and thats not me.

so your saying it could be a bad fuse that drained the battery, that why you suggesting a fuse test?

what do you suggest i do to keep the battery good up until the time the problem is resolved or i get it in the shop? if i charge it back up itll just drain again in a day

charge it then unhook it? or i guess maybe thats bad for it as well.

 

[Outkast]

charge and unhook

no, what the fuse test does is disables the circut that is pulling power..

ex; say you hook it up, and its pulling 5 amp...you keep pulling fuses till you see the meter lose the amp draw, this means that circut, (whatever fuse you pulled) is your current draw. maybe somthing shorted internally and this is causing your light issue.

and again check and recheck all connections, battery, grounds, the post inside the right front wheel well, EVERYTHING...get some beer invite some friends over and look real hard.

truth is, you may not find it with hand tools...If I was closer, I'd come help

 

[Outkast]

Answer
you need to unhook the negative battery cable and set your mutimeter to amps and connect it between the negetive cable and the battery and that will tell you what kind of draw you have just make sure that your multi meter is set up right.

don't try starting your car like this, it will burn up the meter...

but thats how you hook it up.

car off, disconnect the neg batt cable. put the meter on amps dc, see what the draw is and report back, or go on with the fuse pulling test.

you will see some milliamps being drawn because of radio and pcm memory, but if your bat is weak within hours, I imagine your pull will be 5-15 amps...

 

[Outkast]

Battery Drain
Parasitic Draw Testing
Current Drain Article
Battery Article

© Copyright 2000 - 2006 Chuck Kopelson 12/01/2003
Updated December 14, 2008If this site has helped you consider a Donation. Donation Info
by Wayne O. Wenzlaff and Chuck Kopelson 4/15/2007

What is parasitic draw? All vehicles draw some power from the batteries when the car is shut off. Certain accessories such as clocks, radios remote door openers and alarms always need power. The normal power used is called parasitic draw. It is always a very low draw so it doesn't run the battery down. If you install accessories like shortwave radios or plug things like invertors and portable refrigerators into the accessory socket and operate them too long without the engine running you can drain your batteries to the point where the engine won't start. If there is an electrical short in the vehicle or a malfunctioning accessory it could be drawing much more than its normal load causing a drain on the batteries. If you leave your door open and the inside lights stay on all night you could drain the battery down till the car won't start. My 98 draws 3.5 amps with the front door open. Usually what happens is the truck is dead when you first go to start it.


The first thing to do is a test for a major short. Remove the positive and negative cables from the batteries. Put an Ohm-meter across the positive and negative cable. If your reading is close to 0 Ohms then you have a direct short. I read 150 ohms on my stock 98. You need to trace the short before you can perform the following tests.

In order to check for parasitic draw, you need to be careful so you don't ruin your meter. At the risk of sounding like an elementary teacher, here's what you need to do.

1.If you don't already have one, get a digital meter capable of reading up to 10 amps DC. Sears sells them for less than $50 - I bought one on sale for $14.99 that I leave in my truck.
2.Your battery must have a reasonable charge for this test - it won't work if your battery is dead. Quick proof - if your dome light operates normally, you're fine. My truck wouldn't start and the batteries were down to 5.5 volts so I put a charger on the batteries overnight. They are now 12.2 V. When I started the truck the voltage went to 14.3 V so the alternator is working.
3.Check to make sure ALL loads are turned off. Unplug anything you may have plugged into the cigarette lighter. Remove your keys from the ignition. Close all doors so the dome lights are off.
4.Disconnect the thick positive (Red) cable that goes down to the starter.
5.To start make sure your meter is set to the 10 amp DC range. Some meters have a special connector for the red probe when you are reading current. The meter pictured on the left has one jack for high amps and one for low amps. If yours does, make sure the meter end of the probe is in the right connector. You can either do this next step by just holding the meter probes to their respective contact points (you won't get a shock from 12 volts) or you can use probes with alligator clips to snap them in place so your hands are free to do something else.
6.Connect the positive probe to the battery - either battery is fine, electrically speaking, since they are connected together by the negative (Black) wires. Polarity on digital meters doesn't matter because they are autosensing.
7.Connect the negative probe to the red cable that is still connected to the vehicle. Make sure this cable and your probe do not touch ground.
8.If there is a severe current draw (more than 10 amps) it will either pop a fuse in your meter or destroy it outright. That's why you need to test for a short, otherwise, your meter should now be reading the current drain on your battery.
9.If your vehicle has an alarm system or remote locks, the current draw may be around 2-3 amps for a few minutes after you last close the door. This is normal. If you're not sure, wait at least 20 minutes after you last open or close a door before you take a reading.
10.If everything is normal, you will read less than 35 milliamps, or .035 amps. If the current drain is higher than that, you need to find out what is draining your batteries: You can start by pulling fuses until the load goes away. If that doesn't reduce the draw, you need to look for a wire that is corroded or frayed.
Happy Hunting!


Measuring Current Draw


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


It took awhile to figure it all out over several YEARS. I kept replacing batteries, with the problem much worse in the winter than summer, when it was rainy than dry.

I had several shorts in my truck.

the winch
the light system to all gauges
a hot wire to an amplifier


When you do a parasitic draw test in a dual battery system and you have an electric winch, you should rewire the truck temporarily as two separate circuits, one to the winch and one to the truck. Each should be checked independently from the other.

If you are drawing too much current in the truck, my first steps would be to check engine compartment components. Disconnect the hot wire to the alternator to rule out diode backdraw in the alternator itself. Then, disconnect the main engine cable connection to the electrical block.

Disconnect all add-on components wired directly to the battery or positive main engine block terminals. Look for elimination of the excessive amperage draw, one item at a time. Disconnect the starter motor, check the draw.

Once the engine compartment is ruled out, I would go to the fuse box under the dashboard and disconnect all add-on components wired to the fuse box or extra hot leads (one always hot, one ignition controlled hot) that AMG supplies for add-ons. Do this one at a time, looking for correction of your excessive current draw.

Finally, I would pull all fuses one at a time.

In my case I had corrosion on the winch hand controller connection that allowed for a constant low current flow. Even the wires to the winch were blackened inside their insulation. The winch itself never activated spontaneously. I moved that connection far away from the winch and away from salt spray from the road.

I had a short in the shifter that ultimately caused a short to ground and blew fuses when I turned on the lights which activates the panel lights. I replaced the shifter (obviously, more to this story).

I had a large aftermarket hot wire to the amplifier (connected to the battery with a fuse) that rubbed the insulator coat off and grounded to the body when it was wet or metal of the body contracted in the cold and completed the circuit.