How about that. In tank/hose(?) oil cooler. Never saw that kind before

J

Jim Henderson

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Just did my first change on my 2004 LSV8.

While looking around underneath, as is my habit, I noticed that our oil filters sit on a somewhat complicated mount and that there were two hoses on it. Aha, I thought, we have an auxilliary oil cooler.

I was kind of right. I was thinking a small radiator like thing, but instead to my surprise, the cooler lines go into the main hose going from the lower radiator outlet to the top of the engine. So, either the hoses go down the main hose down into the radiator where there is an oil cooler inside the tank. Or, the hoses go into a coil of tubing inside the hose itself. As far as I know This is rather unique, I never saw it done this way before, I've seen the coolers inside the tank, but never going thru the radiator hose. very different and kind of an elegant solution, or Rube Goldbergish depending on your point of view.

If we ever have to replace that hose or the hard plastic housing, I bet it is expensive.

A few other comments while chaning the oil... There is not a lot of room down there, it is not going to be easy to work on the underside of the engine, but then let's hope we never need to .

I wonder if we have an auxilliary tranny cooler. I don't have all my jack stands etc so I wasn't able to get enough room to really crawl around and look. What with the relative common problems with the auto tranny and my own experience with this tranny showing evidence of over heating at less than 15,000 miles, I plan to put on a small cooler, IF I can find the room, mighty tight.

Just my impressions.

Jim Henderson
 
The way it was explained to me, the '93 and newer LSes use an oil to water heat exchanger, which is actually in the cannister onto which the oil filter is screwed. The hoses are just carrying the coolant to/from the main coolant stream. (The pre-'93 LSes have their oil heat exchanger in the radiator.) It's supposed to be the same as was on the V6 SHOs, but my old '95 is about two hours away, so I can't compare them directly...
 
Hmm, that is interesting and would explain the very large size of the filter adapter. An interesting solution to that type of problem.

Jim Henderson
 
I've seen a similiar setup on several pieces of heavy equipment... first time I've heard of it on a car.
 
SoonerLS said:
The way it was explained to me, the '93 and newer LSes use an oil to water heat exchanger, which is actually in the cannister onto which the oil filter is screwed. The hoses are just carrying the coolant to/from the main coolant stream. (The pre-'93 LSes have their oil heat exchanger in the radiator.) It's supposed to be the same as was on the V6 SHOs, but my old '95 is about two hours away, so I can't compare them directly...
Click to expand...

do you mean 03 and newer - right?
 
Yes, thats an oil to coolant exchanger, some benifites include.

Faster warmup of the engine oil, which reduces ring wear and block wear.
More stable oil temperatures than an oil to air (which can get the oil way too cool on the insterstate)

I've got an oil/air on my turbocharged car, but I wouldn't suggest it for street cars, oil to water is the only way to go. Oil needs to be over 180 degrees to function right.

That has been the only type of oil cooler offered on Fords for many years now. (Oil to water)
 
Quik LS said:
do you mean 03 and newer - right?
Click to expand...
Umm, no, I was talking about the, err, the special dealer-installed "Pre-'93" option package. Umm, yeah, that's the ticket. ;) :waving:

D'OH! Sorry; I had a serious case of brain-fade there; it should definitely be '03 and newer and pre-'03... :slam
 
Putter-GLHT said:
Yes, thats an oil to coolant exchanger, some benifites include.

Faster warmup of the engine oil, which reduces ring wear and block wear.
More stable oil temperatures than an oil to air (which can get the oil way too cool on the insterstate)

I've got an oil/air on my turbocharged car, but I wouldn't suggest it for street cars, oil to water is the only way to go. Oil needs to be over 180 degrees to function right.

That has been the only type of oil cooler offered on Fords for many years now. (Oil to water)
Click to expand...

Putter,
How'd you get so informed on LSs? Do you have one hidden away that you are not showing us? If you don't have one, do you work on them all the time? Lincolnlov
 
I'm a tech at a Ford Dealership. I work on cars all day, then I come home at night and continue on my own until about 9, then read about cars until about 11. I'm 21, went through Ford's tech training, and have been at the dealership for 3 years. I have nearly completed all the requirements for Ford Master Tech.

I spend more time around cars than is probably healthy. :)
 
Well, Putter that explains it! Congratulations on getting close to that Master Tech. certification. Too bad I don't have access to a guy like you around here. Still, glad that you are interested enough in LSs to spend time on this site. Its the guys with answers that that deserve a great big THANKS. Lincolnlov (the old guy).
 
Lincolnlov said:
Well, Putter that explains it! Congratulations on getting close to that Master Tech. certification. Too bad I don't have access to a guy like you around here. Still, glad that you are interested enough in LSs to spend time on this site. Its the guys with answers that that deserve a great big THANKS. Lincolnlov (the old guy).
Click to expand...


:I :I :eek2: you spend ALOT of time on cars Congrats on everything you've accomplished!!
 
SoonerLS said:
The way it was explained to me, the '93 and newer LSes use an oil to water heat exchanger, which is actually in the cannister onto which the oil filter is screwed. The hoses are just carrying the coolant to/from the main coolant stream. (The pre-'93 LSes have their oil heat exchanger in the radiator.) It's supposed to be the same as was on the V6 SHOs, but my old '95 is about two hours away, so I can't compare them directly...
Click to expand...


Actually there has always been an oil/water cooler on the 3.9. If you look at the filter housing you can see the black cooler before the filter with a send/return hose going to the radiator. to the left of the housing is the oil pressure transducer. It has always been like that. The lines you see coming from the pass. side of the vehicle under the air damn going to the radiator are actually trans cooler lines.
 
On the 2004, the two black rubber hoses from the filter housing go directly to some nipples on a hard plastic black 2" pipe that appears to be part of or connected to the 2" rubber hose that goes to the radiator. There is no sign of an oil cooler connected to these small rubber hoses, just the hard plastic pipe.

So I would guess Ford changed somewhere before 2004 to the strange plastic pipe connection, which one guy said is just a water tap for the cooler which is actually in the filter mount.

It is fairly tight under there so can't say without a doubt , but that is the way it appears to me. I have seen other oil coolers before but the 2004 is nothing like what I have seen.

Jim Henderson
 
They've used a rather crude version of this way back in '84 on the turbo 4 cyl mustangs.. there was a sandwitch module that was directly behind the oil filter... which lead to the PH2 filter over the longer PH8A. It just took two half or three quarter inch water lines to make work. The police 351's in the Crown Vic's up to '91 used a really mean air to oil exchanger that hooked right to the block and screwed in like a filter, then you screwed the PH2 into it again. This is what I'm running on my 351 Capri. Works great.

We need a real tranny cooler on these cars.

And, what the heck is the trick to taking the damn oil filters off the V8 cars? I bought one of the universal wrenches that fit 90% of the filters from the end, and guess what? We're part of the 5% that it doesn't fit...
 
kleetus said:
We need a real tranny cooler on these cars.

And, what the heck is the trick to taking the damn oil filters off the V8 cars? I bought one of the universal wrenches that fit 90% of the filters from the end, and guess what? We're part of the 5% that it doesn't fit...
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Yeah, I want a real tranny cooler, if I can find the space.

As far as filter wrench. I bought a nice little jobbie at Autozone last week. It looks like two half moons mounted on a flat plate with springs etc. It is essentially a 3/8 square drive ratchet tool.

You slip the half moons over the end of the filter. Then you tighten the ratchet action by just turning the rathcet. It works fine. Only gripe I have is that it can be tricky to spread the half moons out over the filter, and then the wrench might slip before it gets a grab of the filter, so you will need to hold it in place and turn the ratchet til it bites.

I accidentally bought another filter wrench while I was deciding between several, and forgot to take the other one out of the basket, duh. Anyway the other wrench looks promissing. It is essentially a handle with a bicycle chain that you wrap around the filter. I think that may work on the LS.

On previous cars, I have really liked the Griots Garage wrench that looks like a giant pair of pliers. Works great if you can get it over the filter, fastest and easiest wrench I have. I also have a nice steel band wrench that is very thin and works fine, I think it is a Lisle.

The reason I have so many wrenchs is, 1) I am away from home and my tool box for a long term, 2) I am a tool and gadget hound.

Of the wrenches I have used here is my preference... 1) Griots pliers, 2) Steel Band wrench. 3) Half moon type, at least for small filters. The chain wrench has promise but I have not used it yet. It probably will work like my band wrench but won't fit in tight places but should have a better grip.

Jim Henderson
 
Jim Henderson said:
Yeah, I want a real tranny cooler, if I can find the space.

As far as filter wrench. I bought a nice little jobbie at Autozone last week. It looks like two half moons mounted on a flat plate with springs etc. It is essentially a 3/8 square drive ratchet tool.

You slip the half moons over the end of the filter. Then you tighten the ratchet action by just turning the rathcet. It works fine. Only gripe I have is that it can be tricky to spread the half moons out over the filter, and then the wrench might slip before it gets a grab of the filter, so you will need to hold it in place and turn the ratchet til it bites.

I accidentally bought another filter wrench while I was deciding between several, and forgot to take the other one out of the basket, duh. Anyway the other wrench looks promissing. It is essentially a handle with a bicycle chain that you wrap around the filter. I think that may work on the LS.

On previous cars, I have really liked the Griots Garage wrench that looks like a giant pair of pliers. Works great if you can get it over the filter, fastest and easiest wrench I have. I also have a nice steel band wrench that is very thin and works fine, I think it is a Lisle.

The reason I have so many wrenchs is, 1) I am away from home and my tool box for a long term, 2) I am a tool and gadget hound.

Of the wrenches I have used here is my preference... 1) Griots pliers, 2) Steel Band wrench. 3) Half moon type, at least for small filters. The chain wrench has promise but I have not used it yet. It probably will work like my band wrench but won't fit in tight places but should have a better grip.

Jim Henderson
Click to expand...


IMHO if you bought one of these cars (up to $44k) you better be able to afford to have someone work on them. Mean no disrespect but the more they cost, the harder they are to work on. Not for the weekend garagers unless they have something equally as nice to drive!:)
 
Any boob can go down to jiffy lube and get an oil change... If you can afford the car, you should be smart enough to be able to protect it and have it last. I'm sorry but any more, after reading many folks posts here about the "professional" dealerships and the guess work they do to fix the car, and most often do not, I think I can poke around in the garage for a while and at least learn something to pass on to someone else. It's not that they are so complex, just the right tool does the job better and faster.
 
kleetus said:
Any boob can go down to jiffy lube and get an oil change... If you can afford the car, you should be smart enough to be able to protect it and have it last. I'm sorry but any more, after reading many folks posts here about the "professional" dealerships and the guess work they do to fix the car, and most often do not, I think I can poke around in the garage for a while and at least learn something to pass on to someone else. It's not that they are so complex, just the right tool does the job better and faster.
Click to expand...


I agree, just because you can afford the car, doesn't mean you should dump your brains and mindlessly let a dealer do the work. It is nice to just let someone else do it but also a very good idea to at least know what is going on so you know whether the dealer is on the right track. Besides, tinkering is my hobby.

I do not have enough experience with the Lincoln yet, but in almost every experience with dealers in the past, I have usually found that 1) They were way too expensive for the work they did(independents are better but good ones hard to find), 2) Too much guesswork and remove and replace til it works, 3) Some are just plain incompetent(had one try to sell me on a timing belt for a V6, when I knew it was a straight six with chain, all the manager said was "Oh", 4) Some will cheat you(big time) if they think you know nothing. Some dealers are good, but still they do the remove and replace versus find and fix which is often much less expensive. Have a dealer do a complete brake job for you one of these days especially if it needs replacement parts, wow!!

On dealer incomeptence, I once spent almost $2K for a dealer to figure out a problem with my SHO. He never did fix it, just remove and replace. I finally got a scanner and found the problem. The scanner told me EXACTLY what was wrong and which module to replace, I fixed the problem for $50. Why couldn't the dealer do that? In my opinion, it was because I was stupid enough to keep going back and too lazy to do it myself.

I have worked on almost everything with an engine that I or my family has owned since before I could drive. I have not yet found a problem(in over 35 years) that I couldn't handle technically. Most of the times if I take it to a dealer it is because of warranty, time pressures/laziness or lack of proper equipment(this is rare). Only problem I haven't attempted is a tranny rebuild since I don't yet ;^) have the proper tools to do it right.

With a good code scanner and some shop manuals you can handle probably 80% of the projects on a car, if you have the time. An oil change should be one maintenance item we all do, it gives you the opportunity to get to know your car, and while you are under there, you should inspect and shake everything you can find. I have found many small problems this way that I fixed, usually for free, before they became big expensive problems by just looking around.

Some people treat a car as a transportation module that requires no personal attention, I treat mine as an interesting device worthy of learning what makes it tick and keeping an eye on potential problem areas.

I started tinkering because I was cheap and I am mechanically inclined. Now I do it because I am still cheap(even though I theoretically can afford to pay some one) and inclined, but also because I think I can do most things better.

BTW some people should not be trusted with the pointy end of a screwdriver, so to those I heartily recommend they find a trusty mechanic.

I get my jollys, when covered with hot oil and squirming around on my back. Others prefer to spend their time at a spa and have someone else slather hot oil on them.To each his own.

Jim Henderson
 
Jim Henderson said:
I get my jollys, when covered with hot oil and squirming around on my back.
Click to expand...
It's funny, that's how I spent college (under my Chrysler). Now, I'll do anything to a car that doesn't require lying down...or getting dirty. Window regulator? Hell yeah, let me at it. LS power steering pump? No way.
 
My back doesn't like it much when I bend over the engine all day, but laying on my back working on stuff isn't too bad unless it is with my arms up for several hours.

Just a hobby so I can quit when I want. Poor guys in garages don't have the option.

Jim H.
 
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