Is this normal? How hot is too hot?

[gtate]

I've had my '06 LS V8 for about six months now. It has 102K and within the first 90 days cost me over $3000 in repair costs. The last was replacing the overflow (degas?) bottle over two months ago.

About a week or so ago I noticed that the electric fan comes on once it warms up and never goes down off again. I don't recall ever even hearing the fan before this so I tried to pull codes several times with no issues. The car seems to run fine and mileage hasn't changed. I'm kind of gun shy with this car due to all the issues I've had so I got a real time OBDII scanner to see what the temperatures are while driving. It's running between 227* and 234* depending on whether I'm idling or on the highway. This seems VERY hot to me but I don't know the car well enough.

What could be causing this? Thermostat? Something else? Any suggestions as to what to be looking out for? Am I just paranoid?

BTW, since I've bought this POS I've replaced the entire AC system, the overflow bottle, the coils, done a tuneup, all the pulleys and the alternator. It's a beautiful and pristine car without a single cosmetic flaw. If only it was as reliable as it looks.

 

[joegr]

The fan is variable speed and will always run pretty fast with the AC on. With the AC off, in the summer time it will always run some at idle after the engine warms up.

The thermostat opens completely at 219 F.

 

[gtate]

The fan is variable speed and will always run pretty fast with the AC on. With the AC off, in the summer time it will always run some at idle after the engine warms up.

The thermostat opens completely at 219 F.

I read that about the thermostat in other posts. I saw that some folks are running at around 225 or so max. That said, I didn't find any older posts with temperatures as high as mine but they seemed to mostly be regarding cars with the hydraulic fan. Are my temps normal? It's getting almost up to 235*

 

[rallyusa]

I would question whether the cooling system was bled properly, if it wasn't it's possible that you have air pockets in the system that are causing it to run hot. Also check in front of your radiator to see if it has leaves or debris blocking it.

 

[Ranchero50]

I noticed mine is gurgling when I shut it off after the run home from work... Figure it's about time to burp it and pray.

 

[joegr]

I read that about the thermostat in other posts. I saw that some folks are running at around 225 or so max. That said, I didn't find any older posts with temperatures as high as mine but they seemed to mostly be regarding cars with the hydraulic fan. Are my temps normal? It's getting almost up to 235*

I think that the 230s are a little high. If they didn't replace all the plastic cooling system parts at the front of the engine, that's probably where the problem is.

 

[joegr]

I noticed mine is gurgling when I shut it off after the run home from work... Figure it's about time to burp it and pray.

Air doesn't get into a correctly working cooling system. Bleeding out the air may help you for a few hours to a few days, but you have a leak somewhere. You are going to have to find and fix that leak.

 

[Ranchero50]

Yeah, figured as much. It's kind of a one second gurgle gurgle sound up buy the overflow bottle about 30 seconds after I shut it off.

 

[gtate]

I would question whether the cooling system was bled properly, if it wasn't it's possible that you have air pockets in the system that are causing it to run hot. Also check in front of your radiator to see if it has leaves or debris blocking it.

I had the dealer do the work. I guess they could have goofed it up but this only recently started. The work was done a couple of months ago.

I'll probably just replace the thermostat for GP and bleed the system myself.

 

[joegr]

I had the dealer do the work. I guess they could have goofed it up but this only recently started. The work was done a couple of months ago.

I'll probably just replace the thermostat for GP and bleed the system myself.

Correct bleeding procedure.
http://deneau.info/ls/s6x~us~en~file=s6x33004.htm~gen~ref.htm#extract_142

 

[rallyusa]

I had the dealer do the work. I guess they could have goofed it up but this only recently started. The work was done a couple of months ago.

I'll probably just replace the thermostat for GP and bleed the system myself.

If you're going to replace the thermostat, go ahead and replace the housing as well, it's possible that it's broken off from its weak plastic mounts and is not allowing maximum flow of coolant, this thread gives you an example of how the plastic cooling parts will degrade and break over time http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=84514. When I replaced my plastic cooling parts last month, it wasn't as bad as what's in that thread, but the plastic pieces that hold the thermostat in place were both broken off.

Unfortunately most manufacturers are using plastic for all of their cooling components nowadays, my grandmothers 2006 Honda Accord just needed a new thermostat housing and coolant crossover pipe due to a "stress crack" forming, a friend of mine at work with a 2005 BMW X5 has had a similar issue and he spent about $2000 to have most of his plastic plumbing replaced for "preventative" purposes at 110K miles...

 

[RigsLS]

Kudos to joegr,

a wealthy of information and truely an expert in the Lincoln LS arena.
on behalf of others and myself, thank you joegr for all your help.
lot of people would be guessing at problems without you around.

:: amazed

 

[gtate]

Mystery solved. My thermostat housing is cracked. When going through the bleeding process I saw the antifreeze leaking out through the neck of the filler tube.

Bummer.

 

[joegr]

Mystery solved. My thermostat housing is cracked. When going through the bleeding process I saw the antifreeze leaking out through the neck of the filler tube.

Bummer.

While cracking of this part is common, don't fool yourself. The engine fill tube neck has a passage in it from the wider part of the neck where the cap screws on to the outside. If you fill coolant nearly to the top of the neck, it will pour out from lower on the neck. It looks like a leak, but it isn't. The o-ring in the cap is below the passage, so it won't leak with the cap on.

Here's pictures of what I am talking about.

 

[gtate]

While cracking of this part is common, don't fool yourself. The engine fill tube neck has a passage in it from the wider part of the neck where the cap screws on to the outside. If you fill coolant nearly to the top of the neck, it will pour out from lower on the neck. It looks like a leak, but it isn't. The o-ring in the cap is below the passage, so it won't leak with the cap on.

Here's pictures of what I am talking about.

Arghhh. Yep, I fooled myself. I've already ordered the part too. It was a bit low on water so i filled it back up. I even tested to see if that quart or so made a difference but it didn't. It still went straight to 225* within 10 minutes of idling. As soon as I started to drive the car it shot up to 230*.

I'm just going to replace the thermostat, the housing and bleed the system. I suspect that the thermostat spring isn't compressing quickly enough or far enough anymore at is warms up.

I'd really like to see the documentation as to what the normal operating temperature range is supposed to be but I can't find it anywhere. If it's in the shop manual, I can't find it. The ECU obviously thinks that 234* is OK or it would have thrown a code and reported it as overheating. That seems WAY too high to me though.