Land Speed LS

Next?

Since it's zero or less outside, I can't drum up the effort to go digging through boxes to find my Konis. But that just leaves time to puzzle over other aspects of my project.

I'm giving more thought to the transmission. There's another thread here asking questions about transmission strength and it made me think it over some more. There seems to be a revision of thinking on this. I called Len at Lentech and put several questions to him. He is of the opinion that, as much as anything, due to the size of the input shaft, the upper limit of use of the 5R55 is at about 400 RWHP. I've put the same questions to Force 10, but have had no reply from them, although I asked several days ago.

OPEN QUESTION TO THE FORUM---

What has your experience shown, and what input have you had from anyone supposed to be technically qualified ?

I'm looking at the use of a ZF HP 38. This is the six speed supposedly used in the 500+ HP supercharged versions of the Land Rover and Jaguar. Using one of these would at least have one starting with the proper bolt circle against the engine block. There are several other alternatives, including a C-4 with a Gear Vendors OD.

Any and all input is welcome!!!
KS
 
Dude, dont make a fast a$$ automatic car man, unless u need ur grandma to drive it.
If ur doing so much stuff for ur car, be the first to swap in a 5 or 6 speed manual tanny. Then ur car would cost a lot more money and be pretty much the rarest car in the US !

Do u have some pics of ur roll cage ?? Seems like u can ride 3 girls in the back seat even tho u got a roll cage !!
 
See the beginning of this thread---along about # 11 or so.

In regard to the trans, it's very often thought best to use an automatic when the torque really starts to climb. One of the very best things about the combination of boost and spray is that when either (or both at once) are turned down, the resulting engine has mild characteristics. I expect my dual turbo combo to be capable of thirty plus pounds of boost. My spray system will deliver four hundred or more HP and an equivalent amount of torque. Gear changes with a manual trans are brutal when you are making north of 1K HP. I'll most likely work out a way to use an automatic.
KS
 
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Its cheapier to build a bullet proof manual than auto.
U said 1k+HP?? r u planning to drive it everyday ??
I wanna take a ride on that b|tch when done bro !
 
Man this is exciting!!!!! I had forgotten all about this thread. So I guess there is someone out there with enough funds to stick a jag engine in the ls and make it work.
 
$$$$$

Alax7 said:
Man this is exciting!!!!! I had forgotten all about this thread. So I guess there is someone out there with enough funds to stick a jag engine in the ls and make it work.
Click to expand...

This is not an unbearably expensive project. Engine goes something like this---
GRP aluminum Rods +/- $1000
Ross pistons +/- $ 800
Barnes/Aviaid dry sump system complete +/- $2500
Extrude Hone and other head work +/- $1000
ARP fasteners +/- $ 350
Turbo hardware +/- $2000

All the above figures represent the likely cost to acquire the items on the open market. I haven't included the cost of rings, bearings, gaskets, etc. as such things will all cost roughly the same for an ordinary re-build as for performance work. I paid $750 for a somewhat tired but unbroken '99 4 litre Jag AJ 27 engine as a core. And because I have a degree of sponsorship from the suppliers of the parts listed, it'll cost me something less than the figures I've shown. But I could do this job on a budget of $10,000. That's cheap for the power levels we'll generate.

And because the engine will be mild when not boosted or sprayed, but hell for strong, it'll regularly see street time. I'll trade off between it and my '63 F-100 ICB.

I intend to use the original computer and inputs so that I'll be able to tune with my SCT package.
KS
 
Well seeing as I paid 12,000 for my ls, paying 10,000 to stick a jag engine in there seems like a lot. I would do it if I had the funds though, In a heart beat! That is a lot lower than what I thought it would cost though.This is a great thread. Good luck with the build
 
Just purchasing and installing a used Jag engine could very likely be done for 5K or less. And thanks for your good wishes!!
KS

UPDATE--An hour later.
I just got a call back from my parts locator. They can give me a 4.2 Jag engine with 58K miles and a year warrantee for $2300 and change shipped. I'd think it quite possible to get someone to do the swap for a grand and of course you'd have some extra expense for incidentals. Now does it look more do-able?
KS
 
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Horspawah

Just got a call from my transmission guy. (See concerns above) He assures me that for my purposes (Not drag racing) it's entirely possible, by using some strengthened parts, to transmit 1K and more of HP/torque. I therefore plan to put transmission concerns aside and use one of his concoctions.

On another subject, I also connected with a Jaguar guy this afternoon. His daily driver is an 'R' model supercharged car; he's done such things as to upgrade the intercooler and change pulleys. He figures to be pushing about 500 HP and confided that he drives it hard. FWIW, he has no concerns regarding the powdered-metal factory rods. The 'R' model engine uses forged pistons. We've formed a pact to exchange information. Here's an untapped source of technical information. More later!:cool:
KS
 
cammerfe said:
Just purchasing and installing a used Jag engine could very likely be done for 5K or less. And thanks for your good wishes!!
KS

UPDATE--An hour later.
I just got a call back from my parts locator. They can give me a 4.2 Jag engine with 58K miles and a year warrantee for $2300 and change shipped. I'd think it quite possible to get someone to do the swap for a grand and of course you'd have some extra expense for incidentals. Now does it look more do-able?
KS
Click to expand...

Well now that you put it that way, that does seem a lot cheaper. So you really think you'll get the pcm to work right and still have all the same functions of the ls?
 
Computer use

Alax7 said:
Well now that you put it that way, that does seem a lot cheaper. So you really think you'll get the pcm to work right and still have all the same functions of the ls?
Click to expand...

By using the original factory computer, you keep the ability to run all the apps of the car. There will be a degree of adapting to use the inputs from the Jag engine, but since the engine architecture is the same, it should be relatively easy to program so that the computer is satisfied. There'll be some differences, such as the drivers for the VVT, but I intend to lock out the VVT anyway. (The supercharged iteration of the Jag doesn't use cam timing changes.) If the sensors in the Jag engine aren't identical, I'll install the LS pieces. Not entirely a 'piece-a-cake' but not unbearably difficult.
KS

And, by the way, I see indications that you can buy an entire blower motor starting at about $4500-5000.:shifty:
 
Since I'm working up a series on the mods I'm doing, to be published in one of the performance venues, I won't post more pictures here. When the writing project goes together, I'll post links. There are three photos on the first page that show the roll cage. The main hoop is shown best in the photo taken through the driver side rear door. From there, there is a 'halo' that runs forward and has two legs that follow the 'A' pillars. You can see the driver side in the photo showing the add-on instrument cluster. There's also a tube that follows the top of the wind screen. And to finish off, there are a pair of tubes that go above the back, side windows and go through the package tray to mounts that are in line with the rear suspension in the trunk. I'll have to put in some extra bracing to get my 175 license.
I hope this helps !
KS
 
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A little quick math

I've just read Joeychgo's post regarding the latest Hennessey Cadijunk. For those of us with a fondness for the Lincoln LS here's some numbers to think on. The Jag AJ 4.0 litre engine makes about 300 HP and the blown version thereof goes for about 400 HP. That's on about 6-7 pounds of boost. A little quick math will show that the 30 pounds plus available from a pair of the turbos setting on my bench at present, will make 800-900 HP a reality. Now add 400 HP of spray, and the use of methanol as a fuel/chemical 'intercooler' and count on your fingers one more time. Of course, the ultimate number remains to be posted after the engine-dyno session. I go like this--->:D.
KS

(And, of course, a little knob ready to hand, makes for whatever degree of boost you should desire. Less than 10 pounds for daily use makes for relaxed motoring, and 'destroy' requires nothing more that a twist of the wrist and flipping a couple of switches!)
 
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Headers

Although it may make no sense to even think about headers for my coming four litre AJ/Turbo build, it never hurts to see what might be possible.

Therefore, I've just had a hand-shake agreement with a custom/production header builder to explore the ups-'n'-downs of making headers for our cars.

Realize, however, that it might well be that a hands-on examination of my car will result in a decision NOT to go ahead with the project. But they are able to work in 321 and his work---I've seen it---is beautiful.

We've agreed to get together and do some 'eye-balling' sometime soon.

I'll post here again as things go together.
KS
 
Nice, looking forward to that. Little by little, the progress keeps unfolding. How long has this project been going,3+ years? It's great to see it still alive.
 
Started the racing in '07. Bought a core engine for parts in the fall of '07. Better late than never!!!
I have too much going on and a somewhat limited budget to work with. And all the parts either have to be obtained from England or made from scratch or both.
KS
 
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The results of the latest Maxton meet have just been posted. I'm pleased to say that we still hold the records in both classes!
KS
 
I don't know. When I first started, in '07, there were two other LSs and a Jag there; my first try was in E/FSS. And I was after an established record. In order to run in E/F CC I was required by class rules to have at least one of a list of body modifications. I chose a 60%+ belly pan. The record I broke was also an established one. SS doesn't allow methanol, but CC does. I don't know who might have been trying at the meets where I haven't run.
KS
 
cammerfe said:
I don't know. When I first started, in '07, there were two other LSs and a Jag there; my first try was in E/FSS. And I was after an established record. In order to run in E/F CC I was required by class rules to have at least one of a list of body modifications. I chose a 60%+ belly pan. The record I broke was also an established one. SS doesn't allow methanol, but CC does. I don't know who might have been trying at the meets where I haven't run.
KS
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Cool. Just wondered how tough it was to become the best in the category. I didn't know if there were 5 or 100 other competitors in your class.
 
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