Obama wants to know if you know how to wipe your arse.

MonsterMark

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$5,000 fine if you don't tell the government how many sheets of toilet paper you use to wipe your behind. Change is on the way!
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Mandatory Census survey inquires about citizens' difficulty undressing, bathing

http://aprilsillustrations.blogspot.com/2009/06/mandatory-census-survey-inquires-about.html
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Posted: May 27, 2009
11:00 pm Eastern
By Chelsea Schilling
© 2009 WorldNetDaily

The federal government is forcing 3 million Americans to disclose sensitive, personal information about finances, health and lifestyle in a 14-page survey – including questions about availability of household flush toilets and difficulty with undressing and bathing.

The 2009 American Community Survey, an annual supplement to the decennial Census, asks about residents' personal relationships and whether a home has hot and cold running water, a flush toilet, bathing facilities, appliances and phone services. It also asks how many rooms are in a home and what vehicles are used at each household.

The new questionnaire asks respondents what they pay for electricity, gas, water and sewer every month and whether residents receive food stamps.

Question 16 asks, "About how much do you think this house and lot, apartment, or mobile home would sell for if it were for sale?"

Respondents are required to disclose costs associated with rent or mortgage, annual real estate taxes on and fire, hazard and flood insurance expenses.

For each person in the household, the questionnaire asks for citizenship status, education level, whether that person attends private or public schools. It also features questions about health coverage, hearing and vision impairment and physical, mental or emotional conditions.

It asks if residents "have difficulty dressing or bathing" or "doing errands alone such as visiting a doctor's office or shopping" or whether they have difficulty making decisions. Respondents must indicate if they have served in the military, their current marital status and whether they have been married or given birth to children in the last 12 months. The Census Bureau claims its question is used as a "measure of fertility" and is used to "carry out various programs required by statute, including … conducting research for voluntary family planning programs."

The letter asks where residents worked last week and whether they drove a car, rode a bus, subway railroad, ferryboat, taxicab or bicycle to get there. It then asks what time they left for work and how long their commute lasted.
While many recipients may consider the questionnaire to be tedious and meddling, the Census Bureau warns that citizens are required by law to complete it and may be fined as much as $5,000 for willfully refusing. While an individual may feel uneasy about answering each question truthfully, the fine for filing false information can be as much as $500.

The Census Bureau estimates that the form takes an average of 38 minutes for each household to complete.

While the U.S. Constitution allows Americans to be counted for purposes of taxation and political representation, Jim Harper, a privacy expert at the Cato Institute, told the New York Post the survey is "a classic example of mission creep over the decades – this constitutional need to literally count how many noses are in the United States has turned into a vast data-collection operation."

Rep. Ron Paul blasted the government for spending "hundreds of millions of dollars" on the survey and called the questionnaire "insulting" in his Texas Straight Talk column.

"The questions are both ludicrous and insulting," he wrote. "The survey asks, for instance, how many bathrooms you have in your house, how many miles you drive to work, how many days you were sick last year, and whether you have trouble getting up stairs. It goes on and on, mixing inane questions with highly detailed inquiries about your financial affairs. One can only imagine the countless malevolent ways our federal bureaucrats could use this information. At the very least the survey will be used to dole out pork, which is reason enough to oppose it."

Paul continued, "The founders never authorized the federal government to continuously survey the American people. More importantly, they never envisioned a nation where the people would roll over and submit to every government demand. The American Community Survey is patently offensive to all Americans who still embody that fundamental American virtue, namely a healthy mistrust of government. "
 
I heard about this a few weeks ago. If I ever get the survey, I'll send it back unfilled out and attach a $5000 check to it.


But I doubt I'll ever get such a form to fill out. 99% of the stuff I own is owned by various businesses. Not much in my name, so I stay well below the census "radar".
 
I heard about this a few weeks ago. If I ever get the survey, I'll send it back unfilled out and attach a $5000 check to it.


But I doubt I'll ever get such a form to fill out. 99% of the stuff I own is owned by various businesses. Not much in my name, so I stay well below the census "radar".

or you could wipe your ass with it...then send it back
 
Case law set a precedent in 2000, the Census has no authority to prosecute you for not answering the questions.
 
Case law set a precedent in 2000, the Census has no authority to prosecute you for not answering the questions.

The $5000 threat is enough to intimidate nearly everyone into doing it.
And if the did decide to prosecute, how much can you afford in legal fees fighting it? The government assuredly has deep pockets.
 
The $5000 threat is enough to intimidate nearly everyone into doing it.
And if the did decide to prosecute, how much can you afford in legal fees fighting it? The government assuredly has deep pockets.
I'm not trying to argue with you. I'm just stating a fact.

Americans should not be forced to risk their freedom in the process of petitioning the government for a redress of grievances.
 
if you look deeper it looks like some of the questions are aimed at cross referencing with ss benefits to people who cant work anymore etc to see if you lied about it but i agree its a little over the top for sure ok maybe a more then a little
 
I heard about this a few weeks ago. If I ever get the survey, I'll send it back unfilled out and attach a $5000 check to it.


But I doubt I'll ever get such a form to fill out. 99% of the stuff I own is owned by various businesses. Not much in my name, so I stay well below the census "radar".

If you live in a place where people usually live, you should get a form. Before the forms go out, census workers update the address list used for sending the forms out. The address list is supposed to include every house, apartment, dorm, nursing home, hotel, etc that there is in the country - wherever someone lives or 'could live.'


Regardless, I don't see the big deal unless you're a tinfoil hat conspiracy nut. Confidentiality is protected by title 13 of the US code. (Well actually all census data is released 72 years from when it was collected.) None of the information gathered is used by any other government agency on any level than the Census department.

Oh, and the Census department has pretty much nothing to do with Obama. Which should be apparent to anyone with common sense. Then again this was posted by MonsterMark..
 
If you live in a place where people usually live, you should get a form. Before the forms go out, census workers update the address list used for sending the forms out. The address list is supposed to include every house, apartment, dorm, nursing home, hotel, etc that there is in the country - wherever someone lives or 'could live.'

Wanna bet? I live in a place to which the directions include "Turn off the main road onto the dirt road, go to where it ends and call me"... kinda.

Regardless, I don't see the big deal unless you're a tinfoil hat conspiracy nut. Confidentiality is protected by title 13 of the US code. (Well actually all census data is released 72 years from when it was collected.) None of the information gathered is used by any other government agency on any level than the Census department.

Uh-huh... Right.

Oh, and the Census department has pretty much nothing to do with Obama. Which should be apparent to anyone with common sense. Then again this was posted by MonsterMark..

Then why is the President so eager to shift control of the Census to the White house?
 
Oh, and the Census department has pretty much nothing to do with Obama. Which should be apparent to anyone with common sense. Then again this was posted by MonsterMark..

Actually, Obama has usurped the census from the Commerce Department to being overseen by the White House; specifically Rahm Emanuel. In fact, no less then Obama's former Commerce Secretary nominee cited this point as one of his reasons for withdrawing his nomination.

Don't talk authoritatively and dismissively on things you are clearly ignorant on.
 
The more that people comply with this, the more ridiculous it's going to get. I personally vote for the "wipe your ass with it and send it back." I can't imagine filling out a survey that detailed and not feeling dirty and used afterwards. What individuals do in their home is THEIR business. This is BLATANT DISREGARD FOR PRIVACY :mad:
 
Regardless, I don't see the big deal unless you're a tinfoil hat conspiracy nut.
Broad brush, nonsensical statements like this are exactly why you have no credibility. Frankly, the real nuts are those who are completely naive and blindly trust the government never to do anything that isn't in the best interest of freedom. It's all well and good when somebody questions George W. Bush; they're just speaking truth to power. But when somebody questions the mighty Messiah, he's a tinfoil hat conspiracy nut. :rolleyes:
 
Wanna bet? I live in a place to which the directions include "Turn off the main road onto the dirt road, go to where it ends and call me"... kinda.

It doesn't matter where YOU in particular live, it matters that if you live in a place where someone could live, which you do, your address is probably on the list. The enumerators don't care who lives where, but if they see a place where someone could live, it goes on the list. So unless you live in a shed on the other side of a hill from the dirt road - where an enumerator cannot see any trace of your living quarters, your address is on the list.

Don't talk authoritatively and dismissively on things you are clearly ignorant on.

I just quit working for the Census department, I know a thing or two about the operation. I doubt the 2 articles you've read on the subject compare to my firsthand experience. And believe it or not, we're not out to get you, we don't even know who you are.

Oh, and instead of having the Census dept report to just the Commerce secy, they're having the dept report to another White House designee as well does not equal end-of-the-world hostile takeover.

This is BLATANT DISREGARD FOR PRIVACY :mad:

Warrantless wiretapping? Sure. Census info? Nah.

Broad brush, nonsensical statements like this are exactly why you have no credibility. Frankly, the real nuts are those who are completely naive and blindly trust the government never to do anything that isn't in the best interest of freedom. It's all well and good when somebody questions George W. Bush; they're just speaking truth to power. But when somebody questions the mighty Messiah, he's a tinfoil hat conspiracy nut. :rolleyes:

I find it entertaining to throw a bit of sanity into your right wing nutjob circle jerk once in awhile. Deal with it.

Oh, and it's all well and good when you blindly follow W into a war based on invented intelligence, but when you don't care that a constitutionally required institution is doing it's job, the sky is falling.

But anyway, if all you have to do is worry about one of the most innocuous department in the entire government... find something better to do.
 
It doesn't matter where YOU in particular live, it matters that if you live in a place where someone could live, which you do, your address is probably on the list. The enumerators don't care who lives where, but if they see a place where someone could live, it goes on the list. So unless you live in a shed on the other side of a hill from the dirt road - where an enumerator cannot see any trace of your living quarters, your address is on the list.

I give up. Obviously, you know where my residence is, since you know my "address" (which I don't have one) is...
 
Sorry, I should specify that the address list doesn't include JUST addresses. Your living quarters don't have to have a street number, or be on a street for that matter. They still go on the list if they're visible from any other street, dirt road, or other living quarters.

Well, unless you get a lazy enumerator in your area.
 
I find it entertaining to throw a bit of sanity into your right wing nutjob circle jerk once in awhile. Deal with it.
In other words, you get off on trolling. Yeah, we know your type.

Oh, and it's all well and good when you blindly follow W into a war based on invented intelligence, but when you don't care that a constitutionally required institution is doing it's job, the sky is falling.
Red herring. Also, please show me IN the Constitution what the requirement of the Census Bureau is. You won't find anything in there about needing to know how much money I make or how many toilets I own.

But anyway, if all you have to do is worry about one of the most innocuous department in the entire government... find something better to do.
Your condescension is surpassed only by your ignorance.
 
I'm not trying to argue with you. I'm just stating a fact.

Americans should not be forced to risk their freedom in the process of petitioning the government for a redress of grievances.

We're in agreement.
I'm just pointing out the unfortunate reality- that the intimidation will work.
 
I just quit working for the Census department, I know a thing or two about the operation.
Great.. a government employee.

Gee, what are the chances this government employee votes party line Democrat?

And what are the chances that this particluar type of employee has no trouble sticking his face into your business, because after all, its his job?

And you guys wonder why I say there is a civil war coming between the producers and the takers (and yes, I include goverment employees as part of the taking group).

The mindset one must develop to have no problem working against your fellow American is not something I can easily understand.

I guess the money is all that matters. As long as the government is paying you, why not stick your nose where it doesn't belong.

Answer the question posed by shagdrum...
Why is Obama attempting to take control of the Census Bureau?
 
Yeah, I'll get in your business if it's my job. I'm trying out for the Sheriffs dept in about 2 months, so I'll really get in people's business then if the situation warrants it. I haven't paid much attention to this forum in the past, MM, what's your stance on the NSA guys who stick their face in your business because it's their job?

Oh, FYI I've never once voted party line. I don't like the fact that that's even an option.

And adding a White House designee to the list of people the bureau reports to does not constitute a takeover.

In other words, you get off on trolling. Yeah, we know your type.

The word troll has such a negative connotation... Sure I post things that most of you here disagree with - that you might consider controversial or inflammatory. But what I post is relevant to whatever the topic happens to be, and I don't make stuff up to bother you people. But it is true that if you right wingers weren't so militant/extreme, I wouldn't bother, so I suppose in a way I am trolling.
 
Yeah, I'll get in your business if it's my job. I'm trying out for the Sheriffs dept in about 2 months, so I'll really get in people's business then if the situation warrants it.

But it is true that if you right wingers weren't so militant/extreme, I wouldn't bother, so I suppose in a way I am trolling.

In my book, getting into somebody elses business ISN'T a job. That's a big do nothing kind of job, and exactly why its part of what is draining our economy. Too many people like you getting paid way too much to do nothing. WOW, now we might have another egotistical, he-man cop, exactly what we DON'T need.

What is your reasoning for saying the right is so "militant/extreme?"
 
Yeah, I'll get in your business if it's my job. I'm trying out for the Sheriffs dept in about 2 months, so I'll really get in people's business then if the situation warrants it. I haven't paid much attention to this forum in the past, MM, what's your stance on the NSA guys who stick their face in your business because it's their job?

Oh, FYI I've never once voted party line. I don't like the fact that that's even an option.

And adding a White House designee to the list of people the bureau reports to does not constitute a takeover.



The word troll has such a negative connotation... Sure I post things that most of you here disagree with - that you might consider controversial or inflammatory. But what I post is relevant to whatever the topic happens to be, and I don't make stuff up to bother you people. But it is true that if you right wingers weren't so militant/extreme, I wouldn't bother, so I suppose in a way I am trolling.
Funny. You make a statist comment about trying out for sheriff so you can bully people, and then you call us 'right wing militant/extremists.' Can you say hypocrite? Your type is exactly what is wrong with this country. You come across like a statist and a totalitarian, a bully wannabe who was probably beaten up in grade school and is itching for some payback. Arrogant, contemptuous people like you, who want to rule instead of serve, are the reason people like us start talking about police state and revolution.

You would be the worst kind of cop, looking to insert yourself into people's lives instead of looking to serve and protect. Just make sure you paint the proper motto on your car: To punish and enslave. For the sake of those in your county, I hope you lose.
 
I haven't paid much attention to this forum in the past, MM, what's your stance on the NSA guys who stick their face in your business because it's their job?

Considering I bought some one-way tickets on airlines to buy boats and cars and that put me on the terrorist watch list which got me pulled from line every time I showed up at the airport and took 2 years of bitching with the feds to get off the list and they still mysteriously choose to rifle thru my checked luggage as they did just 2 weeks ago when I was in Vegas, ya, I would say I have a problem.

NSA wise, we know who the bad guys are and what they probably look like. Strip searching 80 year old grandmas ain't doing crap to safeguard this country.

So forgive me if I have a healthy mistrust of government.
I've had to deal with the EPA.
I've had to deal with OSHA.
I've had to deal with the IRS.

I've got cop friends that are bad people and they brag about doing bad things sometimes to bad people but even do some stuff I have to honestly admit was funny but still out of line for an officer to do while hiding behind his badge.

So the fact that you now want to be an officer tells me it is possible you don't give a crap about "serving your fellow man" or "protecting the innocent". For you it sounds like another step up in an ego trip of power. Half the guys that become cops have that issue so you wouldn't be unique. You are all about power. Good luck with your newfound power.

Some people need to feel superior and powerful and the only way they get that sensation is to obtain a means of using that power. Cop is a perfect example.

I'm deeply troubled by some Americans willing to be paid to pry into other American's lives and even deeper troubled by those that may choose to take up arms in favor of the government against its citizenship.
 
Considering I bought some one-way tickets on airlines to buy boats and cars and that put me on the terrorist watch list which got me pulled from line every time I showed up at the airport and took 2 years of bitching with the feds to get off the list and they still mysteriously choose to rifle thru my checked luggage as they just 2 weeks ago when I was in Vegas.

So forgive me if I have a healthy mistrust of government.
I've had to deal with the EPA.
I've had to deal with OSHA.
I've had to deal with the IRS.

I've got cop friends that are bad people and they brag about doing bad things sometimes to bad people but even do some stuff I have to honestly admit was funny but still out of line for an officer to do while hiding behind his badge.

So the fact that you now want to be an officer tells me it is possible you don't give a crap about "serving your fellow man" or "protecting the innocent". For you it sounds like another step up in an ego trip of power. Half the guys that become cops have that issue so you wouldn't be unique. You are all about power. Good luck with your newfound power.

Some people need to feel superior and powerful and the only way they get that sensation is to obtain a means of using that power. Cop is a perfect example.

I'm deeply troubled by some Americans willing to be paid to pry into other American's lives and even deeper troubled by those that may choose to take up arms in favor of the government against its citizenship.
Exactly right Bryan. And these people don't care anything about a higher cause, or their civic duty. To them it's just a paycheck, a way to fill the swimming pool and keep the boat and house. In short, it's institutional. To people like MediumD I say, Remember General Gage.
 
I just quit working for the Census department, I know a thing or two about the operation. I doubt the 2 articles you've read on the subject compare to my firsthand experience. And believe it or not, we're not out to get you, we don't even know who you are.

Oh, and instead of having the Census dept report to just the Commerce secy, they're having the dept report to another White House designee as well does not equal end-of-the-world hostile takeover.

Did I say "end of the world hostile take over"? There have been attempts to politicize the Census before. The fact that it is being run by the White House now is a big indicator of that. The fact that Judd Gregg withdrew his nomination because of that is also a big indicator of that. There is also the fact that ACORN is going to be involved in the 2010 Census.

Answer me this; what reason is there to move control of the Census directly to the White House if not to politicize it?

Were you in a high enough position to be able to notice any attempt at politicization? Were you their recently enough to notice? Would you know what to look for? Would you be objective enough and honest enough to call it? Simply because you worked for them doesn't mean anything in and of itself. Unless you are high enough, you are not going to see anything other then changes in procedures.

And considering your condensation toward the notion I doubt you would even consider the possibility.

Warrantless wiretapping? Sure. Census info? Nah.

Assuming you are talking about the FISA stuff, this comment is just plan ignorant. It has been discussed ad nausseum here. Educate yourself.

I find it entertaining to throw a bit of sanity into your right wing nutjob circle jerk once in awhile. Deal with it.

Oh, and it's all well and good when you blindly follow W into a war based on invented intelligence, but when you don't care that a constitutionally required institution is doing it's job, the sky is falling.

But anyway, if all you have to do is worry about one of the most innocuous department in the entire government... find something better to do.

So, you are not interested in an honest discussion, only in harassement. Fossten was right; you are a troll. :rolleyes:
 

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