Overheating, I've done what I'm willing to do.

[SoulSoak]

Short and simple. I replaced the Upper/Lower Radiator hoses as well as the Degas cap and Engine fill cap last weekend. Bought new coolant even though the old stuff was from last August when I replaced all of the other cooling plastic components. I did the bleed out procedure according to this just like I have the previous time.

http://deneau.info/ls/s6x~us~en~file=s6x33004.htm~gen~ref.htm#extract_142

But my car decided to overheat YET AGAIN. I will admit that I was getting on it a little bit, did a couple third gear pulls up to 5500rpm. But was just cruising around town with a buddy yesterday and the temp decided to creep up to 3/4sh, floating up and down between 3/4 and half way. This immediately put a knot in my stomach because I've literally replaced everything. Just because I want to rule everything out, I'm going to post how I bled my car after the hose installation.

1. Removed Engine fill and Degas caps.

2. Opened heater air bleed.

3. Filled the Degas bottle and let it slowly equalize throughout the system. Did this until the coolant started to come up at the engine fill neck.

4. Installed Degas cap.

5. Slowly added coolant to the Engine fill neck until the coolant would completely fill the neck, and then slowly travel back down through the system. This process took several minutes until the coolant level remained at the top of the neck without lowering (filling system).

6. Installed Engine fill cap.

7. Started engine and turned the heater speed to full blast and temp to 90degrees. Air was set to the defrost (Windshield position).

8. Waited for coolant to exit the heater hose. It would exit in periods of 5 to 10 seconds at a time until it eventually came out "Steady" with no breaks. This process was maybe a minute or two tops. Closed the heater bleed valve.

9. Allowed the engine to idle for 5 minutes. I did not have to add coolant to the Degas tank.

10. I opened the heater air bleed and had a small amount of air purge out. Closed the heater air bleed.

11. Held the throttle at 2000-2100rpms for 5 minutes. Hot air was coming from the windshield vents great, and everything was sound. No coolant leaking or anything out of the ordinary.

12. Changed the climate control unit to 75degrees and allowed the car to idle a couple more minutes.

13. Shut the car off and allowed to cool.


Did I do something wrong here? I don't believe so but God only knows. I want to be 100% certain because I have no idea what the hell to do anymore. I've dumped $750 in cooling plastics and have completely overhauled the system with the exception of the radiator itself.

If the bleedout procedure I've posted was correct, then I really am at a complete loss as to what to do now. Any logical advice would be greatly appreciated.

I mean it's just so weird because the car will say it's overheating via the temp gauge but I hear no coolant boiling or anything from the engine. I just don't know what to do anymore. And this doesn't happen all the time. I've went for a couple 35-45minute drives since last weekend (The install), and have had no abnormal temperature gauge readings or anything. Then all of a sudden it ****s on me again.

I did talk with my wife and have decided that if anyone in the West Michigan area would like to make some money, I'm offering $500 for your time if you can fix it. I'll pay for whatever parts nessecary, but I have replaced everything so I have no idea what to do. But like I said, $500. Already talked it over with my wife and she said and I quote "Just get the ****ing thing fixed". So that being said, if anyone would like to fix it my offer stands. Contact me via private message and I'll give you my phone number.

Any DIY advice is appreciated, but I just feel so defeated by this fkn thing now I can hardly look at it. As fine and sexy as it is lol. Anyhow God bless guys, let me know what's up.

 

[G-RELL]

did you replace the Degas bottle...or just the cap?

 

[1LoudLS]

I would go through the bleeding procedures one more time.

and heres the key, if there is any more air trapped in that bubbles out, then you still have a leak somewhere.

if its not a leak, I would look at seeing if it has a coolant flow problem like the water pump or a clogged radiator...

 

[SoulSoak]

I replaced the degas cap last weekend. I replaced the tank well as every other plastic cooling component last August. All my parts from fordpartsgiant OEM.

If my radiator was clogged would I be able to drain coolant from it? If so then I suppose I could go about replacing it, just so tired of throwing parts at the car now. Well... tired of throwing parts at it with no successfull results I should say.

Any troubleshoots for me to figure out if it's a bad water pump or the radiator?

 

[joegr]

I think you may have a leak somewhere. After each drive, check everywhere (especially at the front of the engine) for any traces of coolant. If the metal engine surfaces that the seals press against aren't perfectly clean and smooth, you may get an intermittent leak. You may have to put some tack seal on. Check the radiator side tanks too. Other possible leak sources are the DCCV and the aux pump. Your coolant is a 50/50 mix of aluminum safe coolant, correct? Has any sort of leak stop ever been used? Have you removed and inspected or replaced the water pump? Are you certain that the thermostat is correctly assembled?
Lastly, you might run an exhaust gas test on the coolant (very long shot).
Is your fan working (did it get very loud before the gauge started going past the halfway mark)?

 

[stugots]

I would hook up a scan tool when the gauge goes to the 3/4 mark just to see what the temp is..

I had a leak at my water pump on my 03, also I've heard of cracks in the radiator.

 

[daffyduc]

Just throwing this out there. Have you verified the temp?

Bad grounds will cause all kinds of misreads on sensors. If you can replicate the problem sitting in a parking lot, have a scan tool thrown on it and see what the actual temp is. It does not appear to be displaying signs of overheating. If you throw a scan tool on it cold, you could also verify your thermostat is opening at the right temp.

Other than that, fans working properly and no leaks is about it (at least non lincoln specific)

 

[1LoudLS]

if the sensor was "misreading" then it would also be misreading when the scanner tell you what that reading is...

 

[Telco]

if the sensor was "misreading" then it would also be misreading when the scanner tell you what that reading is...

I agree with this statement. A scanner can only verify gauge accuracy. An infrared scanner would be a better option to verify whether the gauge is misreading. Besides, Joe advises that the temp gauge doesn't register an accurate temp, and will only head north when the temp is really high to avoid panicking vee-hickle owners.

 

[joegr]

... I mean it's just so weird because the car will say it's overheating via the temp gauge but I hear no coolant boiling or anything from the engine. ....

Assuming that you have a 50/50 antifreeze mix, you have to get to over 265 F for the coolant to start boiling. You are overheating well before that. If your fan is working, the surface temperature of the engine (except for the exhaust area) and cooling parts will be less than the internal temps and reading that may mislead you.

 

[RigsLS]

SoulSoak, just for sh*ts and giggles, try taking a look closely between the radiator and oil cooler. (might have been condenser core)
See if something got caught up in there and blocks a portion of the fins. When I did my cooling system overhaul,
while cleaning up and around I noticed some crap down in between the two elements and it turned out to be part
of an old plastic bag with hardened mud all caked on, had to rinse and poke at it with a long steel ruler.
Eventually got it all out and cleaned up, inspected the fins afterwards also.

Probably not your problem as it;
a.) never did cause overheating to mine,
b.) should/could have resulted in a constant overheating, not intermittent.

worth a look anyhow!


You sure the thermostat and fan is ok on that?

Cylinder Head Temp sensor?

Coolant Temp sensor?

 

[jolinc01]

Check all your connections, make sure the fan is kicking into high, check for obstructions of the fins on the radiator, and try to bleed it again. Another option is to buy the black light dye and a black light, put it in the coolant and use the black light to check for leaks after it's ran for a few minutes.

 

[SoulSoak]

Thank you for all of the helpful replies guys. Today I played some poker with a few buddies at my house after work. After they left I went to do some inspecting on my LS. The temp was cold so I decided to go about the bleedout procedure just to see if I could get any air purge from the heater bleed valve. When I opened the bleed valve after a good 5-7 minutes of idle or so, I got steady warm coolant but no air/bubbles purged out this time. So there wasn't air locked up in there.

I let it cool off whille I grilled some brats/hotdogs/burgers. Then decided to start it back up and run the A/C on full blast to check the fan. The fan does turn on, I hear a click as soon as I activate the A/C on the climate control unit. But the fan DEFINATELY isn't running at a high speed. Barely on if anything.

Anyhow I have decided that I'm just going to have to drive her and next time she starts getting warm... I'm going to bite the bullet and let her. Once she starts getting warm I'm going to pull over, pop the hood and check out everything while shes still running. Check on the fan speed, check for anything abnormal etc. Might just drive the damn thing til' it goes into fail safe just to see if it will. Hopefully if there's a weak spot or a leak, it'll just blow loose and I'll know where to go from there.

Anyhow I have to go for now. Thanks again for all the replies and advice, I'd have gotten back sooner but have been very busy. Thanks guys, will keep you posted. God bless

 

[Ranchero50]

Along with what everyone else has said, you should definitely hear the fan when it kicks onto high speed even inside the car. Mine is pretty loud when warm with the AC on.

You can also check the hoses to make sure they are all warm or hot to the touch . If you find a cooler one it may be showing a flow or lack of water problem.

Are you losing any coolant, is your coolant level dropping over the course of a week or two? As said above, you might have a tiny leak that is allowing air to enter the system.

Hope you get it figured out before summer.

 

[SoulSoak]

Yeah I suppose I'm just going to have to drive it and continue to inspect until I can find the cuplrit. Just hopefully I find it before any serious damage occurs.

One thing though that just sprung to mind. Was I supposed to use a sealer when I installed my new cooling components? Like for example Blue RV thermostat/waterpump gasket seal maker? Because I didn't. I just used the O-ring seals and bolted the new plastic parts on. Just figured I'd ask.

 

[joegr]

... Was I supposed to use a sealer when I installed my new cooling components? Like for example Blue RV thermostat/waterpump gasket seal maker? Because I didn't. I just used the O-ring seals and bolted the new plastic parts on. Just figured I'd ask.

If the surfaces are clean, you can usually get away without using any sealer.
I've found that this stuff is pretty good to use on the rubber seals (but I haven't tried the new "clean hands" formula).
http://www.amazon.com/Permatex-8093...1396998984&sr=8-1&keywords=permatex+tack+seal

 

[Ranchero50]

On 'O' ring sealing parts I use a light lithium grease.

 

[SoulSoak]

Maybe if I get time this weekend I'll drain the coolant and pull the front cooling plastic body off. Clean it up and use some sealer and reassemble. Then bleed it out and see what happens. However first I just plan to do some inspecting once it decided to overheat again, while it's overheating.

 

[jjcool00]

Let's start with this: List the cooling components you HAVEN'T changed. I assume one is the radiator? What else?

 

[SoulSoak]

Let's start with this: List the cooling components you HAVEN'T changed. I assume one is the radiator? What else?

I've replaced everything including rubber hoses. The only cooling components that remain original are the radiator, water pump, and the dccv.

Is there a water pump and an aux water pump? Or is yhe aux water pump all I have?

 

[jjcool00]

Have you visually inspected the radiator side tanks? I, like you, changed all of my cooling components (mostly) with the exception of the radiator until recently. I was overheating, smelling antifreeze, etc. But it would ONLY leak when I was accelerating so I never knew where it was coming from until I had a buddy of mine step on the gas while I was looking under the hood. Saw the cracked radiator and it spread open when the gas petal was pressed squirting antifreeze out. Check your radiator. The autozone ones are fine as a replacement (better than OEM) and there's always coupons. Got mine for 99$ after a coupon code.

 

[joegr]

I've replaced everything including rubber hoses. The only cooling components that remain original are the radiator, water pump, and the dccv.

Is there a water pump and an aux water pump? Or is yhe aux water pump all I have?

You have both the water pump (belt driven) and the aux pump (electric, for the heater loop).

I'm going to also assume that you haven't replaced the heater core, the hard lines (metal) to the heater core, the heater hoses, the engine oil cooler, or the throttle body (these normally don't need to be replaced).

 

[SoulSoak]

Have you visually inspected the radiator side tanks? I, like you, changed all of my cooling components (mostly) with the exception of the radiator until recently. I was overheating, smelling antifreeze, etc. But it would ONLY leak when I was accelerating so I never knew where it was coming from until I had a buddy of mine step on the gas while I was looking under the hood. Saw the cracked radiator and it spread open when the gas petal was pressed squirting antifreeze out. Check your radiator. The autozone ones are fine as a replacement (better than OEM) and there's always coupons. Got mine for 99$ after a coupon code.

Where was yours leaking exactly? I'll inspect mine some more, maybe I missed something. Either way, I'll be purchasing a new radiator, aux pump, and water pump within the next month. I figure I plan to keep the car no matter what so I'll just replace them all.

If I'm going to do all of this, is it adviseable to just replace the dccv while I'm at it? My A/C works great and everything but I figure why not.

Hopefully after all the new parts and I clean and reseal the surfaces of the cooling plastic mounting areas I'll be good.

This is assuming that the next time my temp gauge is at 3/4 my engine fan will be on high. If my engine fan isn't operating on high the next time this gauge is reading hot then I'll be stumped and it might be time to take the long trip to the Lincoln dealer.

 

[SoulSoak]

You have both the water pump (belt driven) and the aux pump (electric, for the heater loop).

I'm going to also assume that you haven't replaced the heater core, the hard lines (metal) to the heater core, the heater hoses, the engine oil cooler, or the throttle body (these normally don't need to be replaced).

You are correct, I have not replaced those. Where is the electrical driven aux pump located on genII LS V8 Joe? Thanks

 

[jjcool00]

It's hard to explain, although I did come across a picture posted on here before - maybe you can search and find it. But I'll try with words. If you pop the hood and look directly behind where the grille would be if you closed the hood as your facing the car, it would be on the left side of the radiator. Mine had a crack (maybe a rock or something hit it) in the front of the radiator on the left tank. It was visible while squatting in front of the car and looking directly at it. There was some white antifreeze residue on the tank below, which was my indication.