Re&Re - Jag Aluminum Upgraded Thermostat housing - GEN 1 V8

I am going to pull the trigger on the cooling system, might as well while I am replacing chains and tensioners. I dig the aluminum thermostat housing trade up, nice find......

non pressured cooling system....I don't know who said that is a good idea. Preventive maintenance and correction of incipient failure is the key.
 
Yes,I chose to replace the thermostat that had 67K miles on it....wouldn't you? Pressure or NON pressure has NOTHING to do with the thermostat..................it opens against a spring just like when you test it in antifreeze or water before you put it in.....UNpressurized in a pan. don-ohio :)^)

BigRigLS said:
Like replacing a thermostat on a Non-pressurized cooling system?
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BigRigLS said:
Don, why is it you make claim to have a perfect "non-pressurized" cooling system and yours will never or has not to date presented an issue, yet in the back ground you are replacing parts after all? Right ... in the past few weeks I've read post where you mentioned replacing the fill cap, now a Dorman thermostat possibly even housing included. Could it be you are experiencing problems with your aging "non-pressurized" all plastic LS cooling system after all? I think so! Going to tell us you like to keep spares around just in case? (again)







The direct fit Jaguar Aluminum thermostat housing is/was cheaper brand new vs. OEM.

... but I can only assume you are sourcing used OEM parts from the two different junk yard cars you mentioned previously.

You are fixing this cooling system repair with used parts?
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Yes . I'm sourcing from the SIX cars..and picking the better out of them all. So far the coolant outlet and therm have come from the same vehicle. The car ran and drove without issue. So I see no issue with it. Just got into a bad crash. I'll be checking my degas bottle this weekend. I've gotta redrain this coolant given I had a leaking therm
 
It's not advisable but if you MUST put used part on just be sure to pick the parts that have the least amount of small brown pitting and discoloring on the insides.

What you are doing is called patch-work. It won't last but the "told you so" will come later. You are just constantly going to be replacing parts with more used part.

I can understand if times are tough and the budget is not there for brand new OEM parts ... you gotta do what you gotta do I guess. <shrugs>
 
BigRigLS said:
It's not advisable but if you MUST put used part on just be sure to pick the parts that have the least amount of small brown pitting and discoloring on the insides.

What you are doing is called patch-work. It won't last but the "told you so" will come later. You are just constantly going to be replacing parts with more used part.

I can understand if times are tough and the budget is not there for brand new OEM parts ... you gotta do what you gotta do I guess. <shrugs>
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Which... is what I'm doing. I'll brand new it when I get the money. Yea I made sure to do all the basics checking the used parts.
 
don-ohio said:
Yes,I chose to replace the thermostat that had 67K miles on it....wouldn't you? Pressure or NON pressure has NOTHING to do with the thermostat..................it opens against a spring just like when you test it in antifreeze or water before you put it in.....UNpressurized in a pan. don-ohio :)^)
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I'm surprised you're putting a thermostat in to begin with. It's whole purpose is to restrict coolant flow against the water pump within the engine, which is, of course, pressure in the cooling system. I would think that with your hatred of pressure, that you would remove the thermostat. For that matter, why replace the water pump? Inducing standing water to move puts pressure on the water. And pressure is bad.
 
Very PHONEY,Telco. Thermostat area is made to keep pressure from being trapped on either side. BYPASS hose and bleed valve built into thermostat take care of that or we'd all be blowing hoses and parts.Course THAT engineering has been around since the early days of thermostat use.
Like I said,very PHONEY! LOL! don-ohio :)^)
Telco said:
I'm surprised you're putting a thermostat in to begin with. It's whole purpose is to restrict coolant flow against the water pump within the engine, which is, of course, pressure in the cooling system. I would think that with your hatred of pressure, that you would remove the thermostat. For that matter, why replace the water pump? Inducing standing water to move puts pressure on the water. And pressure is bad.
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BigRigLS: I know what I wrote.

At the time of reading your instructions and trying to replace the part, I could not find a swivel or anything equivalent.

It's that simple.

I then found a store that had one that I never even knew existed.


That is why I wrote what I wrote, then revised it. Which I don't remember doing, However, If I did, so be it.

It's fixed. Well, the Thermostat that is.

Yes. Used OEM parts. ... "patch-work" etc etc etc. It's the best I can do at the moment.
 
Really? Heh heh... that's funny. So chopping the size of the hole the coolant must travel through doesn't build pressure? But Don, that's exactly what it's there for. It restricts coolant flow until the coolant hits a set temperature. The pressure allows the coolant to move slowly enough to collect heat, and increases pressure on the cooling system to allow it to collect more heat than it otherwise might, otherwise known as increasing the boiling point. The bypass is there to keep the water pump from building so much pressure that it blows off hoses, and allows some coolant flow to allow the engine to get heat to the thermostat sooner. But yes, the thermostat DOES cause a pressure increase. The water pump pushes water into the engine faster than the thermostat will allow it to leave the engine. This builds pressure. It's the same principal a water sprayer works on. An open hose just dumps water out 2 feet from the end of the hose when held at waist height, but with a sprayer on it can shoot as far as 50 feet.

Now this IS a bit different from the idea behind a pressurized coolant system, which uses the natural expansion of heated water to put pressure on the system. The pressure inside the engine between the water pump and the thermostat is quite a bit higher than the pressure on the rest of the system, like in the range of [RETRACTED UNTIL I CAN PROVE] or so vs the 16 pounds the rest of the system has. But yes, the thermostat does cause the engine to build pressure.
 
Telco said:
... The pressure inside the engine between the water pump and the thermostat is quite a bit higher than the pressure on the rest of the system, like in the range of 30 pounds or so vs the 16 pounds the rest of the system has. ...
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Sorry, this is simply not true. The water pump makes very little pressure.
 
Thanks,Joe....I was just about to tell him it might make a pound or maybe 2 psi of pressure. 16 psi is serious pressure. don-ohio :)^)
 
Admittedly I can't prove my words, so I will retract them for now. It has peaked my curiosity though. Might see if I can't figure a way to measure water pressure inside the block now. If I do figure a way I'll post up the results.

But, even if it is only a pound or two, it's still pressure and pressure's bad, right Don?
 
It's nothing like 16 psi AND it's not pressure on the parts we're talking about(except behind the thermostat). Yes,pressure and heat wear out plastic,Telco. That's one of the reasons why the PVC piping is less dependable than copper. Over the years it gets brittle on the hot water side in a home(50-70 psi).
The water in an Unpressurized system flows,but doesn't push OUTWARD on the pipes,hoses,heater radiator,radiator tanks,radiator channels etc.
I can run a USED parts system and even old hoses and not blow them while you have to have a very sound system to survive the 16psi.
KidLyrics is as good example of a person needing to depressurize. He THINKS he can get by with used parts and a 16psi system,but the odds are more against him. don-ohio :)^)
 
Don-Ohio : Instead of telling me the odds are against, how about you tell me how to depressurize?
 
I guess in a roundabout way I WAS telling you the odds are against you. Sorry. I'm not going to tell you to depressurize until you find the culprit that's causing the overheat.I think it's a bad fan or thermostat(could be a bad water pump,but probably not). Depressurizing will do nothing for the system when you have a faulty thermostat or fan. don-ohio :)^)
 
When you all get a chance, can you head over to my thread and tell me which of these videos I should continue to try and bleed the air from the system?

I was told to test the thermostat which I'm going to test the old one that i previously had on the car. It'll be a few before i can remove the one from the car itself only because the new housing i bought has RV sealant on it.

Thanks! I'll try and continue my issue on my own thread since I'm asking about my own car!

http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/forum/showthread.php?98419-2001-Lincoln-LS8-in-Virginia-(757)/page4
 
Kid_Lyrics said:
Yes, i know that. I did that, 8 times already.
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this needs to be done AFTER the repair has been made...


the procedure itself is not a form of repair.

if you are having to do this, and you did not have to replace cooling systems parts, then there is 0% chance of fixing your car with this...

if you have to do this 8 times, you are either incapable of following simple, straight forward instructions, or (as been told) you have MAJOR cooling system failure/s







honestly, although you may not want to hear this, it may be something you need to consider...

trust me, I understand how cool an LS is (some of the time) but if you need it to get to work, and it is incapable of getting you to work, and you cant afford to fix it without working...

how long can this go on before you are fired and have no work to go to?


new luxury cars usually have expensive maintenance. then god forbid, need non warranty covered repair tend to be insanely expensive. then you take an old luxury car, that had very low production, extremely few companies that make ANY parts for it, and is now having trouble lots of its parts will only make it prohibitively expensive...

you may actually need to sell this car and get something that is actually reliable and can at least get you from point A to point B... hell for the price of just the repair you need, you could just buy a rock solid dependable car and not even need to sell the LS. I have either for myself or friends/family bough quite a few good but ugly and not cool cars from anywhere from a few hundred dollars up to near a grand (pretty much in the range of every repair you will be needing to make that car... again... and again)

hell my trusty rusty caviler starts and runs where ever it needs to go every single time the key is turned... in 6 or so years the only money that has been put in to it (other than tires, brakes, oil and fuel) has been a $13 T stat and a $80 wheel bearing and a $100 battery. never has it not got me to where I need to go, nor had to call for a tow, nor cost me a day at work. (unlike the LS, which on more than one occasion wanted to drive it to work and had to go back inside and switch keys because it wasn't going to get me there that day...

found a $300 honda civic for my cousin after his trans blew out in his piece of sh!t LS (that I tried to keep him from buying since no way was he about to get a good deal spending $2500 on a car that used to cost $40k+ )and he couldn't afford to fix it, after having to borrow money to fix his overheating problem, after having to sell his Xbox to get money to have to fix his windows wont stay up problem... also that car breaking down did cost him one (at least) job. has been driving it for three years and has not had to replace a single thing on the car.
 
Kid_Lyrics said:
BigRigLS: I know what I wrote.


At the time of reading your instructions and trying to replace the part, I could not find a swivel or anything equivalent.

It's that simple.

I then found a store that had one that I never even knew existed.


That is why I wrote what I wrote, then revised it. Which I don't remember doing, However, If I did, so be it.

It's fixed. Well, the Thermostat that is.

Yes. Used OEM parts. ... "patch-work" etc etc etc. It's the best I can do at the moment.
Click to expand...



I understand ... I answered your PM with the same respect to this repair. it's not fun, I wish you the best. The LS cooling system can be a tricky one ... just please don't listen to Don with the "no pressure, leaving the cap loose" idea, it's delusional hogwash that's being promoted on this forum as of late.

The BigRigLS: I know what I wrote. was directed at Don as he tends to recopy others text and writes "Member wrote:" because he has trouble using the supplied "Reply With Quote" button.

I also understand the confusion of the tools listed vs. able to find in the stores. End of the day - as long as you got it done, I was only trying to indicate I had already supplied such info which is/was there for others to read and take advantage of.


One final note: These Lincoln LS all plastic cooling systems, they tend to deteriorate over the 10 (or so) year mark, develops stress cracks and begin to let air in and coolant out when overheating. It's a closed looped system and requires the recommended back pressure to be able to function correctly, it's near impossible to bleed it correctly with too much air in the system and it's completely impossible to run it with no back pressure at all. It's a known fact by long standing member on this forum that the entire system requires a rebuild with all new OEM parts to achieve the desired results. You replace just one part somewhere in line and it strengthens the system in that spot to only produce and issue at another part that's on it's way out.

This requires $$$ of course. OEM parts are not cheap nor free.

You may get lucky for a while replacing a few parts here and there with some junk yard items but in the long run, it's just come back to bite you in the rear end again soon there after.
 
So we have "corresponded" a bit ... :p
 
Big Rig wrote: ` just please don't listen to Don with the "no pressure, leaving the cap loose" idea, it's delusional hogwash that's being promoted on this form as of late.'


Oh,so THAT's what you meant,BR? Well,maybe someone else doesn't understand why I write back to reply to belittling or jesting or wrongheadedness. THEY don't know what you wrote,and hitting reply with quote, just makes them look thru all you said to find why I responded.
I don't see why that should ruffle ANYBODY'S feathers,especially someone who thinks they're absolutely right,like you.
Above if you're talking about back pressure being required,as in 16psi,you are deluding yourself and anyone that believes it.I AM DRIVING BOTH LSes for the last 65K miles total and have had no loss of coolant or overheating at any time except for the BAD AUTO ZONE Thermostat.
You can call it hogwash,but all you're doing is furthering the suffering of the people that are taxing an already weak system.
don-ohio :)^)
 
Others, please don't listen to this here Don with respect to leaving the coolant degas bottle cap loose as an attempt to run the LS cooling system "depressurized" ... also at one point a claim to have removed the gasket was made but if you will have a look at the insides of your own cap, you'd realize it's a bunch of bull.


... On the other hand, if you want to believe the fairy tales and fix your deteriorated cooling system, just Don-it and remove or loosen the caps. That'll fix it !!!





Don, I'm not discussion this with you anymore, the Degas bottle pressure cap is required to be tighten down, not left loose or gaskets removed. Stop promoting on this forum to run a depressurized cooling system in hopes of not blowing out these aging plastic involved parts. Also the recommended oil to be used in the LS motor was NOT 5W30.

Your an idiot ... please add me to your ignore list!
 
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