So how about Palin lately?

Oh really. What message about climate change has she delivered?
Why would you suppose that? Are you really that shallow, that you think only people with a certain IQ are qualified to lead or inspire a nation of free people?
"Unaccomplished proudly untutored?" There you go again, using nonsense phrases. What are you talking about?
What is she running for? I'm not aware that she is a candidate for anything.
It also didn't stop him from whipping the ass of the Soviets and the Democrats at every turn. That's the difference between you and me: You equate election with success - I equate effectiveness with success.
So you're disinterested in politics. Good for you. In that case, why do you belittle those who are interested? And why do you give a tinker's damn who gets elected?

Oh, it's a Christian white thing. So we're racists if we support Palin?
???
Hasn't Obama repeatedly tried to inject faith into the argument, talking about praying, going to the Wailing Wall in Jerusalem, etc.?

So you blindly follow a homogenous cultural norm rather than go your own way? Interesting, considering you just expressed your derision at people whom you accuse of doing just such a thing (Christian white America).
Do you even know what TOTUS stands for? It's a pejorative term. Are you aware that when Palin was speaking at the RNC convention in 2008, her teleprompter malfunctioned, and she seamlessly continued and concluded her speech without it?

Again, I call you to Barry's typical effort without a TOTUS:



Or perhaps you'd like to see this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYPuPASk9-M&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyW9e5QdWxk&feature=related

Her view on climate change is that it is occuring but the causes are natural and/or inconclusive since a lot of the "research" is BS and not subject to peer review.

Yes I believe people who aspire to lead the country should have a higher IQ than the average john Q public but the voters are free to make thir own decisions.

They can elect Chance the gardener from "Being There" :D if they so choose.

Unaccomplished proudly untutored are people of limited talent and/or intellect who resent and are suspicious of those who are smarter and more talented than they are and feel that just being an american should be enough to be entitled to a comfortable lifestyle.

The people who are mad at government are mostly middle aged middle and lower class people who have either lost their jobs or seen their wages stagnate or decline over the last ten years and have to work a second job or do without things they took for granted in the past while the cost of living keeps rising.

Their high paying low skill jobs have been exported to other countries and their value as workers to american corporations have plummeted.

They just happen by their numbers to be mostly white christians.

I don't see too many of the more talented and creative people supporting Palin.

If Palen isn't setting herself up to run for office then what is she doing thrusting herself into the political spotlight.

I didn't say I'm disinterested in politics (there you go again sticking words in my mouth)
I'm casually interested in politics but my glass is always half full instead of half empty like yours so I'll do well regardless of who's in office.

Obama is trying to inject faith into the argument because of the high level of religiousness in this country.
If nothing else it's a tactical thing to pacify and at least not needlessly alienate a large voting segment.

Palin may be able to talk seamlessly at times like Obama but she didn't do herself any favors this time with her grade school crib notes.
 
Which is more important in a leader? being exceedingly knowledgeable, or having wise judgment and the humbleness to recognize the limits of your knowledge and abilities as well as those around you?

I don't think Palin is exceedingly knowledgeble or humble.
Humble people don't go on book tours or join television networks as commentators or attempt to run for president.

She is only wise when it comes to her base.

So IMO she doesn't have either of the 2 qualities you listed above.
 
I don't think Palin is exceedingly knowledgeble or humble.

I didn't ask about Palin or weather you thought she was exceedingly knowledgeable. Here is what I asked:
Which is more important in a leader? being exceedingly knowledgeable, or having wise judgment and the humbleness to recognize the limits of your knowledge and abilities as well as those around you?

Humble people don't go on book tours or join television networks as commentators or attempt to run for president.

Ignoring your jumping to conclusions concerning a presidential run, you think that anyone who is active under the public spotlight is not humble?

Also, I was talking specifically about humbleness concerning the limits of one's knowledge and abilities (and of humans in general).
 
I didn't ask about Palin or weather you thought she was exceedingly knowledgeable. Here is what I asked:
Which is more important in a leader? being exceedingly knowledgeable, or having wise judgment and the humbleness to recognize the limits of your knowledge and abilities as well as those around you?

Do you believe that Palin has 'wise judgment'?
 
I didn't ask about Palin or weather you thought she was exceedingly knowledgeable. Here is what I asked:
Which is more important in a leader? being exceedingly knowledgeable, or having wise judgment and the humbleness to recognize the limits of your knowledge and abilities as well as those around you?


Ignoring your jumping to conclusions concerning a presidential run, you think that anyone who is active under the public spotlight is not humble?

Also, I was talking specifically about humbleness concerning the limits of one's knowledge and abilities (and of humans in general).

I think a good leader has to have both knowledge and wise judgement but judgement is more important.

I'm reminded of the old knowledge adage about knowing the price of everything and the cost of nothing.

A candidate running a campaign has to show the confidence that he/she is capable of leading and succeeding.

Once in office a good leader shows his/her humbleness by picking people who have the knowledge and judgement he/she lacks then weighs and takes their advice into consideration when making decisions.
 
Absolutely! I (and others) simply object to the way in which you characterized those with whom you seem to disagree.
KS

Proudly untutored is phrase that I didn't coin.
I merely added the word unaccomplished.
There are many accomplished untutored people who are inherently smart enough to greatly succeed without formal higher education.
I know some very smart very successful people who have nothing more than a high school education.
I'll admit that I can be pretty arrogant at times and will try to phrase things in a more sensitive manner while still getting my thoughts across.
 
The people who are mad at government are mostly middle aged middle and lower class people who have either lost their jobs or seen their wages stagnate or decline over the last ten years and have to work a second job or do without things they took for granted in the past while the cost of living keeps rising.
Unaccountably, horribly wrong.

Did you even think before you laid about you blindly with that broad brush? :rolleyes:
 
I think a good leader has to have both knowledge and wise judgment but judgment is more important.

And what qualifies as knowledge in your view? Is it complex ideas that can be eloquently articulated; that are intelligible? Is is more then that; is some knowledge unintelligible?

Once in office a good leader shows his/her humbleness by picking people who have the knowledge and judgment he/she lacks then weighs and takes their advice into consideration when making decisions.

Still, even with some of the smartest advisers available, is there a limit to the knowledge they, as a group, are capable of? Are they capable of organizing, distributing and running things better then nature; of improving on what has naturally evolved?
 
Unaccountably, horribly wrong.

Did you even think before you laid about you blindly with that broad brush? :rolleyes:

Laid about you blindly?
The working class has taken the brunt of job losses and wages have been stagnant for 10 years.
 
There are many accomplished untutored people who are inherently smart enough to greatly succeed without formal higher education.

Rush Limbaugh, George Washington, Abraham Lincoln, John D. Rockefeller, Thomas Edison...
 
Interesting take from the HuffPo:

Addressing the Tea Party, Sarah Palin wrote three notes on her hand: "Energy, Taxes, Lift American Spirits." Why? She already had notes in front of her on the podium. Surely she could remember three simple themes. Why write notes on her hand?

Here's my take on why: she knew that they would be visible when she gave the speech. And she knew that she would be made fun of -- as so stupid that she needs to write notes on her hand. And that's one of her most effective tactics -- to be made fun of. It's an integral part of her strategy of standing in for hardworking, Middle Americans, derided by the condescending, know-it-all liberal elites.

So what does the Obama administration do? Press Secretary Robert Gibbs had a great idea: he made fun of her. He wrote a grocery list on his hand at a White House briefing, and belittled Palin for not being able to remember her message. Thus the White House became a vehicle for Palin's narrative of the snooty elites who think they're better than average Americans.

Palin is a brilliant strategist. First, note that I just repeated Palin's key talking points: Palin has even us fellow travelers at The Huffington Post repeating, "Energy, Taxes, Lift American Spirits." Talk about earned media.
Note the last paragraph - it's a tacit admission that the left doesn't give a crap about any of those things. So much for 'common ground.' Who in their right mind isn't 'for' lifting American spirits? Oh yeah, the left.
 
Laid about you blindly?
The working class has taken the brunt of job losses and wages have been stagnant for 10 years.
The people who are mad at govt recognize a runaway Congress and Executive who are spending like drunken sailors, ballooning our national debt and devaluing our currency, while attempting to take over various and sundry aspects of the private sector.
 
Dianne Feinstein used handnotes during a debate in 1990 - against the rules.

I like this post:

It’s hard to believe that real living adults are having this conversation. This is what actually matters to some people.
Forget about Iran becoming nuclear, Obama listening to our cell conversations or spying on prolife groups. It doesn’t matter that Obama just axed space flight, lost or destroyed 19 million jobs and is attempting to take over whatever health care is left that has not yet been destroyed by Democrats. No, none of that matters because Sarah Palin read something off of her freaking hand during a speech.

JellyToast on February 13, 2010 at 4:37 PM
 

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