Aluminium Degas Bottle

C

cammerfe

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Since there is a continuing need for an ultimate degas bottle, I have begun discussion with a fabricating outfit that specializes in small aluminium tanks.

I solicit your input on the following thoughts:

1. There is no 'magic' to the complicated shape that comes from the factory. It simply fills the available space.
2. The degas bottle serves two purposes---
A. It's the high point in the cooling system and therefore serves as a necessity when bleeding the system.
B. It serves as a manifold for the various hoses that connect there---going to the heater, etc.

It's my thought to ask for whatever shape is least expensive to construct and will fit within the factory space and provide a filler neck in the 'factory' position, connection points for the hoses, and mounting points that'll interface with the car.

Please discuss!

KS
 
It's been discussed and had neared production but did not happen.

Look for the discussion here: http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/forum/showthread.php?89341-Aluminum-Degas-Bottle-pending-production!

ALso, I had posted that the MINI seems to use an aluminum bottle for the same purpose.

BMP_mcsg1_tank_md.gif
 
It is also the self air-bleed for the engine (maybe why it's called the degas bottle).
The engine air bleed line is the one that connects to the top of the bottle. Inside the bottle there is a metal tube that runs to near the bottom. This way air/steam bubble out, but can't get sucked back in.

The tank also serves as the (required) expansion space for the coolant. Hot coolant takes more room than cold coolant.

It is also a reservoir of extra coolant to make up for minor coolant losses.

Also, the degas cap has a built-in pressure relief that keeps cooling system pressure from going over about 16 PSI, and prevents negative pressure in the cooling system.
 
I guess this is the tube Joe is speaking of....

degas.jpg
 
joegr said:
It is also the self air-bleed for the engine (maybe why it's called the degas bottle).
The engine air bleed line is the one that connects to the top of the bottle. Inside the bottle there is a metal tube that runs to near the bottom. This way air/steam bubble out, but can't get sucked back in.

The tank also serves as the (required) expansion space for the coolant. Hot coolant takes more room than cold coolant.

It is also a reservoir of extra coolant to make up for minor coolant losses.

Also, the degas cap has a built-in pressure relief that keeps cooling system pressure from going over about 16 PSI, and prevents negative pressure in the cooling system.
Click to expand...

Joe, I find myself a little at a loss regarding the tube referenced. Wouldn't a tube to the bottom guarantee only liquid, with the vapour at the top of the bottle? It would seem that a fitting at the bottom would do the same thing.

And on another note, it's been suggested that an adaptation of an existing item would be the simplest answer. Such an item may end up costing less than $100 and require only minimal work to create a mount. Long 'worm-drive' SS clamps come to mind!

KS
 
cammerfe said:
...Wouldn't a tube to the bottom guarantee only liquid, with the vapour at the top of the bottle? It would seem that a fitting at the bottom would do the same thing....
Click to expand...

There is slightly more pressure from the engine air-bleed, so the vapor in the tube is forced on down and out. It bubble out to the top, where it can't get back down into the tube.
A connection straight to the bottom wouldn't create a siphon, which may be what they are up to here.
 
I have made an aluminum degas bottle and have been using it for quite a while. It works great but the sight tube I put on the side fogged up so I cant see the level. I made it very close in shape and size to the origional bottle.

2145.jpg


DSCF2423.JPG


DSCF2422.JPG


Degas bottle 3.jpg
 
cammerfe,

good luck with the aluminum degas bottle. i wasted almost 1,000$ of my own time and money to get that to work. i made several prototypes, and had a patent pending for a buyer. i contacted every single car part company possible to try to get them on board. i had members send me information about their cars, as well as a statement saying they would buy it. someone would make a killing off of LVC members alone... i showed them every thread on LVC about how ****ty these bottles are, and Dorman was on board at first, but dropped soon after because of manufacturing costs. they want the product to wear out.


let me know if you need anything.
 
If Dorman had bought the rights to manufacture, could they control if that particular design you had created, was manufactured by anyone? If so, then they could essentially deny anyone from manufacturing therefore preserving their plastic tanks and revenue stream?
I guess the Dorman bottles (and needing a Dorman cap?) will last 30 to 40K miles and the Motorcraft one will last at least double that......if Dorman manufactured it to last as well as the Motorcraft, but priced it close to the Dorman, they might get the lion's share of sales. They likely do anyway as most non LVC members and any independent garage likely buys the Dorman for replacements and rarely except the knowledgible and LVC members generally buy the Motorcraft model.
 
I had rough dimensions but most pieces were cut as I welded and I didn't make an as-built drawing. I was doing this on the clock at work so I didn't have time for detailed drawings. I sent lincolnlogs a quick sketch a while back. Im not interested in making any $ from this.
 
Since I started this thread I believe I've found an existing aluminium item that might well be adapted to fit. What I have in mind will not require any tig. When I'm sure my idea can be made to work I'll post details here. You won't be able to adapt it while sitting in your living room but It won't take a fabricating shop either.

KS
 
I realize this is an old thread but has there been any movement on a better degas bottle?
 
I got pulled away to other things and when I was writing the above my degas bottle was still working fine. When it gave up a few months ago, I found one sitting, new that wasn't being used, and got it cheap. The odd-shaped available space is the major problem. It's crowded there, but there are many reservoir tanks available from a plethora of aftermarket sources. There's nothing magic about the factory unit.

KS
 
At the present time, we are spoiled regarding service intervals. It used to be common to do a tune-up every 10-15 thousand miles. Plugs, points, condenser, rotor, and cap in the ignition and a host of other 'wear' items as well. I'm on my third set of plugs, second set of coils, and second accessory drive belt, and have about 170K on the clock. My original degas bottle began to fail at about 165K and I still have all the other original cooling parts in place. There is no suggestion yet of them failing, although they are all very close, I'm sure.

I paid $40 for the degas bottle I installed---although I'm not sure of getting another for that price. I'll NEVER pay $270 for the equivalent of a half-gallon milk jug. There are a number of small aftermarket aluminum or stainless steel tanks that can be modified to fit. I have a gas torch, a TIG and a MIG.

KS
 
^
Having the original cooling system @ 170K is very impressive. At around 140K, is when mine went (original Degas bottle went @ 110K). I replaced with a Dorman @ 110K and then put an OEM bottle in when I did the entire system @ 140K. So the Dorman lasted around 30K, but I could tell it was close to death @ that point.
 
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