auto to manual conversion

[Motts]

Has it been done? Is it possible, I wish i woulda known that there was a v6 manual before i got the auto... if so how much?

 

[eL eS]

No one has done it and I have made the same inquiries. I asked the folks at 5 Star if they might be able to make a parts list but not much became of it. I have communicated with another fellow that has the same ambitions but it has been a while since we have spoken. I will track him down to see if he has made any progress.

I am sure it can be done it is a matter of finding the right technical resource to help us find the physical components that need to be replaced. Are you having transmission problems now?

 

[eL eS]

I started a thread on flatratetech.com and emailed the guy I spoke with a few moths ago. Anyone interested in forming a group to see if this project can be done? The focus would be on teh LS V6 since we know it was shipped with a manual but any V8 owners are defintely welcome.

 

[cj7man]

Hey, I have a 2000 with a manual...the actual swap won't be the problem but I think the challenges would be...1. The PCM. You can get the Manual wiring harness but you would have to have the computer reworked??? Where? and 2. The Getrag is a very weak transmission; thats why they didn't come behind V8s...I know by experience (toasted disc) but there are great transmissions out there that would work with a custom adapter...Ford toploader? I'll stay tuned to this thread as I'd love to swap out the Getrag...even the shifter is terrible.
Don

 

[eL eS]

hey thanks for dropping in cj7man. I spoke with a guy that uses the SCT Flasher and he said that he could disable the auto tran attributes in the PCM. I'd much rather have the stock 5 speed than the stock auto. I have been through 4 seperate component replacements 3 warranty and 1 out of pocket on this bloody auto.

I have no experience with transmissions and considering the learning curve I do not think I will be exploring the potential of not using the getrag unless we can create a large enough group to discuss this. I have no clue about the potential pitfalls in transmission world. I am prepared to do a lot of reading though. So if anyone has a good book or white paper I would appreciate the tip.

 

[eL eS]

I got a reply back from the guy in NJ that is already in the parts buying stage. He is interested in forming a group to discuss and plan the project.

 

[Motts]

I got a reply back from the guy in NJ that is already in the parts buying stage. He is interested in forming a group to discuss and plan the project.

I'm not having any issues with my transmission at the "moment". I just hate driving an auto, and would love to do the swap, if the price is right. keep me posted. :Beer

 

[eL eS]

Well that is good news and I hope it remains reliable for you. Yeah I'd much prefer a manual, in fact I was talked out of it by the dealer when I was shopping for my LS. They had auto's on the lot and encouraged me to buy one of them rather than waiting for the manual. I bought it basically becasue the convinced me resell would be better, resell values suck for this car period. I have learned to never settle and to wait for what I want.

What would you consider the right price?

 

[Motts]

I did a conversion on my 98 honda accord when i blew the trans for 4200

 

[eL eS]

wow that is not bad. Did you have a shop do the work or was it a DIY project?

 

[Motts]

no not a DIY project, well not for me at least.. didnt have all the tools. I had a shop do it.. They are called "Unleaded Racing Technology" They've done a lot of work on my civic, ie (port polish, cam work, head work,pullie, tuned,)which i might add is for sale..... I was thinking about keeping it and just going all out, Turbo.... who knows, i would like to work on the sport trac a lil more but the thought of a manual ls6 sure does sound nice.. like i said if the price is right we'll see.

 

[eL eS]

well that isn't a bad price to pay to have someone else do the work for you. The guy I am speaking with is going to join the forum tonight so hopefully we can tackle this thing collectively.

 

[pragmatic]

The Getrag is a very weak transmission; thats why they didn't come behind V8s...I know by experience (toasted disc) as I'd love to swap out the Getrag...even the shifter is terrible.
Don

I don't know. I know the trans is torque limited but I love mine for the following reasons.

1) Great shifter feel. Goes into to gear very smoothly and shifts with precision
2) Well thought out ratios. The gears seems to be properly spaced. My XR4Ti was horrible with that 2nd was way too high and third too low. Replacing that T-9 with a T-5 from a 4cylinder Mustang was a great improvement in ratios. The LS passes well on the highway if shifted to third (~4400 rpm at 65) allowing you to reach ~100 staying in the power band of the engine.
3) Direct top gear. Less noise and less wear on the highway. Basically in fifth no gears are being used just direct connection of input and output shafts.
4) Small and light. It is one of the lightest 5-speeds around.
5) Smooth clutch engagement.

Down sides are it holds too little fluid (IMHO).
Since it is weak it requires frequent fluid changes (every 60,000 miles).
Engine is rough at higher RPMs needed to move the car and weak at low RPMs.

 

[cj7man]

I don't know. I know the trans is torque limited but I love mine for the following reasons.

1) Great shifter feel. Goes into to gear very smoothly and shifts with precision
2) Well thought out ratios. The gears seems to be properly spaced. My XR4Ti was horrible with that 2nd was way too high and third too low. Replacing that T-9 with a T-5 from a 4cylinder Mustang was a great improvement in ratios. The LS passes well on the highway if shifted to third (~4400 rpm at 65) allowing you to reach ~100 staying in the power band of the engine.
3) Direct top gear. Less noise and less wear on the highway. Basically in fifth no gears are being used just direct connection of input and output shafts.
4) Small and light. It is one of the lightest 5-speeds around.
5) Smooth clutch engagement.

Down sides are it holds too little fluid (IMHO).
Since it is weak it requires frequent fluid changes (every 60,000 miles).
Engine is rough at higher RPMs needed to move the car and weak at low RPMs.

Pragmatic,
I agree with you that its a great crusier...but for performance...????????

It has a huge rubber bushing connecting the driveshaft for smooth launching...the disc is the size used on the Focus and the disc springs are the size of the ones out of a ballpoint pen. All designed for the luxury liner and not performance. THe shfter is very short and very sloppy making it hard for correct performance shifts never mined the location of the armrest that makes the pull from 3 to 4 frustrating on speed shifts.

I'm interested in a swap but maybe a Tremec ? or similar??? and be watching this thread for more info.
thanks Don

 

[eL eS]

thanks for sharing your expeirences. Sounds like a case of the grass is greeener on the other side. Any recommendations of a shop(s) that do transmission conversions?

 

[Motts]

thanks for sharing your expeirences. Sounds like a case of the grass is greeener on the other side. Any recommendations of a shop(s) that do transmission conversions?

there is a place in MI, called Unleaded Racing technology, another called first class auto in Taylor, and another in Plymouth MI.... i can get the contact info if you need.

 

[eL eS]

there is a place in MI, called Unleaded Racing technology, another called first class auto in Taylor, and another in Plymouth MI.... i can get the contact info if you need.

That would be great. I am willing to let someone else do this job but I do not think I am going to pursue the GETRAG TRANNY. If it turns out they are not able to or are not interested it could be a good indicator ofr us to just give up the gig.

 

[Arnett]

Id be interested in this as well. I have a manual already but would like to get something a bit better. The Getrag is a bit weak and as someone else said, even the shifter sucks

 

[eL eS]

I have posted this toic on flatratetech.com as well and a few folks have chimmed in warning that this project could be one of those deep cover CIA jobs meaning it is arduous duty and advise against it.

 

[JES_LS]

Hey Noah, I'm in.
Let me introduce myself,
My name is John, and I am a swap-a-holic. I have done some really crazy engine and trans swaps. Let me give you folks some examples.
1980 triumph tr7 (swapped to a 3.9l v8, tr8 transmission, suspension, steering gear, rear, brakes, oh and buick ignition & charging system)
1979 chevy monza (swapped 3.2 v6 for 3.8l buick v6)
1989 Merkur Scorpio (swapped to a complete cosworth sierra RS powertrain <awd>)
1988 Merkur xr4i (swapped 4cyl/auto to 5.0l v8 with tremmec trans) <friend's car>
1988 mustang Lx coupe (swapped 4cyl for Eaton supercharged/intercooled 3.8l V6 from tbird sc and had custom t5 built) <My Blue Nightmare>
1996 tbird (3.8 V6 to 4.6l Eaton supercharged dohc v8 Tremmec trans) <friend's daily commuter>
1993 rx7 (two rotor 13b for three rotor 20A water intercooled, six speed trans)
1995 tbird (3.8 V6 to 4.6l stroked <to 5.2> dohc v8 with t45 manual transmission) <Friends wife's daily car>
1996 mustang v6 (converted to 6.8 v10 truck motor with t56 manual) <never again, there is not enough money in the world for me to do this one again>
1996 mustang v6 (converted to 5.4 v8 motor with t56 manual) <yup a mustang club members car>
1998 crown vic (convered to a supercharged 5.4 with t56 manual) <the local cops want this car back>
1982 triumph tr7 hardtop (converted to 93 turbo rotary power) <nothing matched up>
1993 mustang lx (4cyl to 4.6l dohc v8 swap with t56 trans and 92 tbird irs + ABS)
1969 Mustang FB (6cyl auto to 4.6l sohc swap with t45 trans, ABS and IRS <don't remember what the IRS was from).
1998 VW ,the last of the flat roof Jettas (swapping four cyl auto for tdi diesel, euro spec manual trans with rare Euro rally golf AWD system) <another one for the never again list>

Now all of these cars are street legal and pass emissions laws. All of them started and ran like any well maintained cars should. Or should I say like they should have if the factory had built them that way.

Now on the earlier ford PCM's it did not really mater if the PCM was for an auto or not, You just got a chip to turn off any of the trans related functions in the pcm. As for The wiring connections, I have poured through hundreds of diagrams of wiring harnesses and swapped way too many pins in the pcm connectors (The one swap needed three chassis wiring harnesses to integrated the chassis power with the new PCM and the new ABS).
As for issues with the Getrag, the clutch and the driveshafts, I think a lot of this is stupid. The factory clutch is a wimp so what, get a better aftermarket clutch (There are high performance clutches for Jags and Focus's, so we are covered there). If the rubber couplings in the Driveshaft worry you that much, get a custom DS made (there is a shop a couple of miles from me will make any DS you need for $350 max (that was the custom sliding shaft I needed for my off road bronco)) so again that is covered.
Have a couple of friends that are hardcore BMW guy's, I was asking them what they thought of the Getrag. They both said it was not the best example of Getrag trans's, but they both pointed out that there are upgrades available for that family of transmissions. Another point is it is durable enough for the factory to install it and warrantee it, so it good enough for now.


Since I found out that the sst functions can be eliminated from the Auto PCM, I don't think that the rest of this swap is that hard. Its really just pouring over diagrams and unbolting a bunch of parts to swap in different ones. Connectors can be found and pins moved. With the torsen unit I intend to stuff in the differential, certain issues with the stabilitrac and TC features loading the trans will be negated.

as for cost there are a couple of good points to keep the cost of this somewhat controlled.
1. Since most folks are not even considering this, how many other people are looking for the parts in the yards and ebay (Not many). I won an auction for a 15,000 mile getrag for the lincoln for 150 bucks. You just have to be patient.
2. If you are taking care of all the automatic specific parts there is a good market for them when you are done (looked at an ls's SST shifter lately on EBay) what do you think you auto trans will sell for, assuming it is healthy (an auction just closed the other night for 1800 bucks for one).

right now my list includes the following items,
v6 differential carrier (preferably a manual trans one, but any V6 will do)
manual transmission crossmember,
manual transmission shifter (is the shift boot part of the shifter, I cannot find a seperate part number for it)
Manual transmission pedal cluster.

I know that I want to buy the clutch master cylinder, hoses and slave cylinder new.
I know that I want to buy the clutch new and I'm working on getting an aluminum Flywheel.
I know at least one source for locating the torsen unit to install in the diff and I'm looking for alternate gear ratios for it as well.

Anyway, If you are interested in this, then let me know. I welcome all the support and information I can get.

 

[eL eS]

SWEET, YOU MADE IT JOHN. Welcome Aboard. When I seen your nick in trhe thread I knew it had to be you. Thanks for sharing your time with us on LVC. Hey, that is an impressive list of DIY franken-swaps. Your wife either enjoys her free time or is insanely jealous, my wife would shop with the free time then get jealous

Is there a seperate Master Cylinder Resivoir? It has been a while since I looked it up but I thougght I had read that the Clutch and Brake Shared a fuild resivoir

 

[JES_LS]

Thanks for sharing your time with us on LVC. Hey, that is an impressive list of DIY franken-swaps. Your wife either enjoys her free time or is insanely jealous,

Well first off she would have to stop being a work-a-holic DBA to see how much time it really takes away. Secondly a friend of mine, once pointed out that "it keeps him out of the strip clubs"

Is there a seperate Master Cylinder Resivoir? It has been a while since I looked it up but I thougght I had read that the Clutch and Brake Shared a fuild resivoir

I'll have to check the DVD again, but I thought that it had a separate reservoir. If it does not then we will see what is involved in connecting to the brake res (here maybe a port to drill out or something like that. I know that the MC is available separately from Brake MC.

 

[eL eS]

Well first off she would have to stop being a work-a-holic DBA to see how much time it really takes away. Secondly a friend of mine, once pointed out that "it keeps him out of the strip clubs"

I'll have to check the DVD again, but I thought that it had a separate reservoir. If it does not then we will see what is involved in connecting to the brake res (here maybe a port to drill out or something like that. I know that the MC is available separately from Brake MC.

My wife is strip club friendly... she talks me in to going or t least that is what she thinks. These days I prefer to save my money for car parts and diapers LOL!

I see you have one of Honda's Finest Cycles. I had an 88 VF1000R a great riding bike. I sold it several years ago but I would love to own another. Not an overly quick bike but it was great on long rides on th Blue Ridge Parkway and other points in the Smokies.

I might be easier just doing a full swap of the parts even if it turns out to be shared. I think it could be justification for a brake upgrade or something .

 

[Arnett]

My wife is strip club friendly

So mine. She loves to go. No better thrill than seeing my old lady stick a dollar in some chicks g-string

 

[eL eS]

So mine. She loves to go. No better thrill than seeing my old lady stick a dollar in some chicks g-string

I will never complain. It can make for a very interesting night out when grandma is watching the little ones.