Gop To Launch 'white Flag'

[fossten]

Ooo, look at that shiny new Herc!

:woowoo2:

 

[JohnnyBz00LS]

I didn't put words in Murtha's mouth.

http://pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/trib/regional/s_399643.html

Yes you did.......

Your words........

It was YOUR leader/traitor Murtha who said we need to turn tail and run from Iraq, that our soldiers were tired and broken down and we were going to lose the war.

Your link.........

By Richard Gazarik
TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Thursday, December 1, 2005


The U.S. Army is "broken, worn out" and "living hand-to-mouth" from fighting in Iraq and may not be able to meet future military threats to this country's security, U.S. Rep. John Murtha said Wednesday.
"They're barely getting by," said Murtha, a ranking member of the powerful House Appropriations Committee and Subcommittee on Defense.

"They're drawing back on equipment buys down the road," said the Democrat, who was in Latrobe, Westmoreland County, yesterday to address an invited group of community and business leaders. "We are not able to buy the equipment because of the cost of the war."

Murtha, of Johnstown, Cambria County, said the Pennsylvania National Guard is "stretched so thin" that it won't be able to deploy fully equipped units to Iraq until next year because of equipment shortages and a lack of training for soldiers.

"They can deploy individuals. They can't deploy units. The equipment is worn out," he said.

Murtha said it will cost $50 billion to upgrade military equipment because of the war, but the government has begun reducing future equipment purchases to save money.

Lt. Col. Chris Cleaver, spokesman for the National Guard at Fort Indiantown Gap, said "there are some deployment concerns." But he said most of the 2,100 Guard members currently deployed with the 2nd Brigade Combat Team cannot be sent to Iraq for a second tour of duty because military regulations limit the number of times they can be redeployed.

Clever said some units had to leave their equipment in Iraq when they returned to the United States, and that could cause problems with training.

Murtha predicted most of the U.S. troops will be out of Iraq within a year.

"I predict he'll make it look like we're staying the course," Murtha said of President Bush. "Staying the course is not a policy."

On Nov. 17, Murtha, a Korean and Vietnam war veteran, publicly called for an immediate troop withdrawal, touching off a political firestorm in Congress that hasn't abated.

"We have to change direction. That's going to happen. ... It's just a matter of time," he said yesterday. "If I had my way, they'd be out sooner."

Murtha also is pessimistic about the stability of Iraq and the lack of trust between American and Iraqi forces. He said the Iraqis know who the insurgents are but don't always share their knowledge with the United States.

He also believes a civil war is likely because of internecine strife between the Kurds, who control northern Iraq, and Sunni and Shiite Muslims.

Murtha said he was wrong when he voted to allow the president to invade Iraq and believes Bush should admit that he made mistakes.

"I admit I made a mistake when I voted for war. I'm looking at the future of the United States military. For some reason, they don't want to admit their mistakes," he said.

Iraqis are fed up with the American occupation because of the personal toll it is taking on their lives, the congressman said. When the U.S. military took back Fallujah from insurgents, American bombings and attacks left 150,000 people homeless.

"A military victory is unattainable if you don't win the hearts and minds of the citizens," he said. "It's time to turn it over to the Iraqis. They'll let us fight there forever."

YOU SAID Murtha stated that "we need to turn tail and run from Iraq".

MURTHA actually STATED: "It's time to turn it over to the Iraqis". No words of "surrender", "running scared" or "giving up" as you shrubbies would like to and claim to hear a dem say.

YOU LIED

YOU SAID Murtha stated that "our soldiers were tired and broken down".

MURTHA actually STATED: "The equipment is worn out", "We are not able to buy the equipment because of the cost of the war", and nothing to the effect that the SOLDIERS are tired and broken down.

YOU LIED AGAIN

YOU SAID Murtha stated "we were going to lose the war".

Murtha actually STATED: "A military victory is unattainable if you don't win the hearts and minds of the citizens." The only way that could be misconstrued into a prediction of "losing the war" is IF GW had no plan of winning the hearts and minds of the Iraqi citizens. DESPITE GW's piss-poor track record to date in THAT regard, do you really think 'ol GW hasn't thought about that requirement for success, and has no plan to achieve it?? If so, you have less faith in you "fearless loser" than myself.

:slam

Busted AGAIN putting words in other's mouths. How's that show leather taste? I'd think by now you are tasting toenails.

 

[MonsterMark]

The only way that could be misconstrued into a prediction of "losing the war" is IF GW had no plan of winning the hearts and minds of the Iraqi citizens. DESPITE GW's piss-poor track record to date in THAT regard, do you really think 'ol GW hasn't thought about that requirement for success, and has no plan to achieve it?? If so, you have less faith in you "fearless looser" than myself.

I finally reached the eureka moment of finally figuring Johnny out. Took 2 years but better late than never.

Anywho, I believe Johnny hates the military and the Federal government. The latter I share some of the same sentiments. But it is the Military that Johnny hates. The Military gave Bush the info. The Military laid out the plan. The military didn't get it right the 1st time. BUT, seeing as how it is difficult to hate a whole bunch of people, Johnny decided Bush would be the next best thing. I just love watching all the misplaced hatred towards Bush. The poor guy gets beaten over the head day-in and day-out for intel and advice than some find to be faulty. Only problem is, people like Johnny are numerous and incapable of figuring out that our military planners are to blame if blame is going to be placed.

 

[JohnnyBz00LS]

I finally reached the eureka moment of finally figuring Johnny out. Took 2 years but better late than never.

Nope, not even close.

Anywho, I believe Johnny hates the military and the Federal government. The latter I share some of the same sentiments. But it is the Military that Johnny hates. The Military gave Bush the info. The Military laid out the plan. The military didn't get it right the 1st time. BUT, seeing as how it is difficult to hate a whole bunch of people, Johnny decided Bush would be the next best thing. I just love watching all the misplaced hatred towards Bush. The poor guy gets beaten over the head day-in and day-out for intel and advice than some find to be faulty. Only problem is, people like Johnny are numerous and incapable of figuring out that our military planners are to blame if blame is going to be placed.

Are you FINALLY admitting that BuSh is NOT performing as a "Commander In Chief" and is instead being lead down the dark alley by the military leaders? Given his military training (playing "scared rabbit" to train pilots), I'm not really suprised at this. This only reinforces my disrespect for the man. I don't "hate" him, I actually feel kinda sorry for him. And I LOVE the military, it just saddens me to see them used as pawns and scape-goats by our incompetent "fearless loser".

 

[TheDude]

I finally reached the eureka moment of finally figuring Johnny out. Took 2 years but better late than never.

Anywho, I believe Johnny hates the military and the Federal government. The latter I share some of the same sentiments. But it is the Military that Johnny hates. The Military gave Bush the info. The Military laid out the plan. The military didn't get it right the 1st time. BUT, seeing as how it is difficult to hate a whole bunch of people, Johnny decided Bush would be the next best thing. I just love watching all the misplaced hatred towards Bush. The poor guy gets beaten over the head day-in and day-out for intel and advice than some find to be faulty. Only problem is, people like Johnny are numerous and incapable of figuring out that our military planners are to blame if blame is going to be placed.

Huh? That's like blaming the the warehouse foreman for a company going belly up instead of the CEO, CFO etc. etc. Bush is the President, it is his job to do the right thing, if he is given faulty information he should be able to filter the 'crap' part out it out.

 

[fossten]

Nope, not even close.



Are you FINALLY admitting that BuSh is NOT performing as a "Commander In Chief" and is instead being lead down the dark alley by the military leaders? Given his military training (playing "scared rabbit" to train pilots), I'm not really suprised at this. This only reinforces my disrespect for the man. I don't "hate" him, I actually feel kinda sorry for him. And I LOVE the military, it just saddens me to see them used as pawns and scape-goats by our incompetent "fearless loser".

Sorry, not buying it. Nice try at backtracking, but too transparent.

You have engaged in frequent and lengthy bouts of hate-speech Bush-bashing crudely disguised as a 'concerned citizen' who 'feels sorry for' him?

Ha ha, don't make me laugh.

I can picture you pounding on your keyboard and slinging froth on your monitor as you slavishly hammer your drumbeat of constant criticism and hatred toward Bush. And he never did anything to you. You are simply parroting everything you've heard from your LWW fringe leaders like Michael Moore and Barbra Streisand.

The fact is that you are SCARED to admit that Bush has had a good plan all along, and HE'S PULLING IT OFF, which means you and your lefty buddies will have to eat crow when it's over.

Look at the Plan Bush has followed so successfully:

1. Removed a vicious dictator from power
2. Restored freedom, schools, businesses, and hope to the people of Iraq
3. Introduced democracy to a country that was not free
4. Gone from dictator to constitution and free elections in THREE YEARS while our OWN CONSTITUTION ACTUALLY TOOK SEVEN YEARS!
5. Already power and responsibility is being handed over to Iraq forces while we keep them safe
6. All this while YOUR lefty leaders undercut, criticized, bashed, lied, and harangued Bush, he NEVER WAVERED, unlike all your Libwack senators who are now saying, "I know I voted for the war, but I made a mistake." (What cowards)
7. Even now terrorist insurgent leaders are separating themselves from the violent fringe elements and are asking to be included in the political process - even the TERRORISTS see the writing on the wall, that they are going to lose - WHY CAN'T YOU?

I wonder if you'll even show up when this is all over, so you can ADMIT to all of us that you are on the WRONG SIDE OF HISTORY.

 

[Calabrio]

Huh? That's like blaming the the warehouse foreman for a company going belly up instead of the CEO, CFO etc. etc. Bush is the President, it is his job to do the right thing, if he is given faulty information he should be able to filter the 'crap' part out it out.

Yeah...he's "Know" what information is accurate and what isn't just by special magic powers. I mean, why would the President rely on the intelligence of the CIA and other nations when he can just go on his on intuition.

Very well thought out, Deville.

However, it is his job to attempt to initiate reform in those organizations. Something he is trying to do.

But, repeatedly, everyone involved says, even if everything was known, the decision to invade Iraq would still have been appropriate.

 

[RB3]

Sorry, not buying it. Nice try at backtracking, but too transparent.

You have engaged in frequent and lengthy bouts of hate-speech Bush-bashing crudely disguised as a 'concerned citizen' who 'feels sorry for' him?

Ha ha, don't make me laugh.

I can picture you pounding on your keyboard and slinging froth on your monitor as you slavishly hammer your drumbeat of constant criticism and hatred toward Bush. And he never did anything to you. You are simply parroting everything you've heard from your LWW fringe leaders like Michael Moore and Barbra Streisand.

The fact is that you are SCARED to admit that Bush has had a good plan all along, and HE'S PULLING IT OFF, which means you and your lefty buddies will have to eat crow when it's over.

Look at the Plan Bush has followed so successfully:

1. Removed a vicious dictator from power
2. Restored freedom, schools, businesses, and hope to the people of Iraq
3. Introduced democracy to a country that was not free
4. Gone from dictator to constitution and free elections in THREE YEARS while our OWN CONSTITUTION ACTUALLY TOOK SEVEN YEARS!
5. Already power and responsibility is being handed over to Iraq forces while we keep them safe
6. All this while YOUR lefty leaders undercut, criticized, bashed, lied, and harangued Bush, he NEVER WAVERED, unlike all your Libwack senators who are now saying, "I know I voted for the war, but I made a mistake." (What cowards)
7. Even now terrorist insurgent leaders are separating themselves from the violent fringe elements and are asking to be included in the political process - even the TERRORISTS see the writing on the wall, that they are going to lose - WHY CAN'T YOU?

I wonder if you'll even show up when this is all over, so you can ADMIT to all of us that you are on the WRONG SIDE OF HISTORY.

A brilliant summation. :iconcur:

 

[TheDude]

Yeah...he's "Know" what information is accurate and what isn't just by special magic powers. I mean, why would the President rely on the intelligence of the CIA and other nations when he can just go on his on intuition.

Very well thought out, Deville.

However, it is his job to attempt to initiate reform in those organizations. Something he is trying to do.

But, repeatedly, everyone involved says, even if everything was known, the decision to invade Iraq would still have been appropriate.

No, I didn't say he knows what is accurate and what isn't. I said it is his job to filter and do the right thing with such information. I expect that from the President. You should too. If I tell you that Barry killed your wife and you take it upon yourself to shoot and kill him, then after the fact it turns out I gave you faulty information, who's more at fault for Barry's wrongful death? Me for telling you faulty information or you for taking me at my word and just reacting?

I don't buy the 'poor Bush was misled' bit, he is the President, he should stand by and own up to every decision he makes.

 

[fossten]

No, I didn't say he knows what is accurate and what isn't. I said it is his job to filter and do the right thing with such information. I expect that from the President. You should too. If I tell you that Barry killed your wife and you take it upon yourself to shoot and kill him, then after the fact it turns out I gave you faulty information, who's more at fault for Barry's wrongful death? Me for telling you faulty information or you for taking me at my word and just reacting?

I don't buy the 'poor Bush was misled' bit, he is the President, he should stand by and own up to every decision he makes.

The elections in Iraq today prove that Bush did the right thing REGARDLESS of the information.

Quote of Betty Dawisha, Iraqi voter, as seen on the news yesterday:

"Anybody who doesn't appreciate what America has done, and the President Bush, let them go to hell."

http://thepoliticalteen.com/video/gotohell.wmv

I guess you would like to tell Betty that you don't appreciate what America has done so she can tell you to go to hell.

*owned*

 

[TheDude]

The elections in Iraq today prove that Bush did the right thing REGARDLESS of the information.

Quote of Betty Dawisha, Iraqi voter, as seen on the news yesterday:

"Anybody who doesn't appreciate what America has done, and the President Bush, let them go to hell."

http://thepoliticalteen.com/video/gotohell.wmv

I guess you would like to tell Betty that you don't appreciate what America has done so she can tell you to go to hell.

I guess all media isn't liberal after all...... Would that be an 'OWNED' ?
*owned*

1) We have yet to see the outcomes of the elections. Only time will tell.
2) I hate to tell you, but one person does not speak for an entire country.

But anyhow, I am happy to hear an Iraqi speak positively towards America.

I guess all media isn't liberal afterall..... Would that be an 'OWNED' ?

 

[fossten]

1) We have yet to see the outcomes of the elections. Only time will tell.
2) I hate to tell you, but one person does not speak for an entire country.

But anyhow, I am happy to hear an Iraqi speak positively towards America.

Ummm...Don't look now, but the VERY FACT that there are elections being held in Iraq IS THE OUTCOME. Remember 3 years ago? Saddam Hussein, ruthless dictator? Oppressed people? Rape houses? Mass graves? Intra-Muslim faction hatred? ALL GONE now because of Bush's decision, which by the way, was supported at the time by your Fibdem leaders. Now they disown their own decisions and you follow in lockstep.

Listen to yourself. Denial denial denial. Nothing will ever satisfy you. You pathologically are unable to admit that Bush has succeeded in Iraq, no matter what happens, no matter how much time goes by.

 

[FreeFaller]

No, I didn't say he knows what is accurate and what isn't. I said it is his job to filter and do the right thing with such information. I expect that from the President. You should too. If I tell you that Barry killed your wife and you take it upon yourself to shoot and kill him, then after the fact it turns out I gave you faulty information, who's more at fault for Barry's wrongful death? Me for telling you faulty information or you for taking me at my word and just reacting?

I don't buy the 'poor Bush was misled' bit, he is the President, he should stand by and own up to every decision he makes.

Actually to be fair you would actually say it this way...

If I told you that _____ killed your wife and based on the following:
He had killed and raped his own family before...
He had forcibly entered his neighbor's house and attempted to take ownership after killing some of that family...
He showed ardent support for other murderers and applauded their actions...
He repeatedly attacked police patrolling his neighborhood...
He offered rewards to murderers in appreciation for their killings...
He had made direct threats toward your wife....
Now would you be fairly justified in thinking that this person did kill your wife? Who would be at fault? Not the husband...not the informer...but _____ for being a low life piece of sh!t that the rest of the neighborhood didn't have the balls to take care of. Justice served. Irregardless of the innocence of one of many crimes.

 

[fossten]

Actually to be fair you would actually say it this way...

If I told you that _____ killed your wife and based on the following:
He had killed and raped his own family before...
He had forcibly entered his neighbor's house and attempted to take ownership after killing some of that family...
He showed ardent support for other murderers and applauded their actions...
He repeatedly attacked police patrolling his neighborhood...
He offered rewards to murderers in appreciation for their killings...
He had made direct threats toward your wife....
Now would you be fairly justified in thinking that this person did kill your wife? Who would be at fault? Not the husband...not the informer...but _____ for being a low life piece of sh!t that the rest of the neighborhood didn't have the balls to take care of. Justice served. Irregardless of the innocence of one of many crimes.

Very sharp.

 

[TheDude]

Ummm...Don't look now, but the VERY FACT that there are elections being held in Iraq IS THE OUTCOME. Remember 3 years ago? Saddam Hussein, ruthless dictator? Oppressed people? Rape houses? Mass graves? Intra-Muslim faction hatred? ALL GONE now because of Bush's decision, which by the way, was supported at the time by your Fibdem leaders. Now they disown their own decisions and you follow in lockstep.

Listen to yourself. Denial denial denial. Nothing will ever satisfy you. You pathologically are unable to admit that Bush has succeeded in Iraq, no matter what happens, no matter how much time goes by.

I guess you bought that "Mission Accomplished" hook, line and shinker huh?

If you honestly think Iraq is a success already, I have another bridge to sell you, Iraq is FAR from over, if any long term 'good' is to come from this war, it has yet to rear its head. The elections being held is a good thing, I will not deny that, but it is far from over and we have yet to see the outcomes of these elections.

 

[fossten]

I guess you bought that "Mission Accomplished" hook, line and shinker huh?

If you honestly think Iraq is a success already, I have another bridge to sell you, Iraq is FAR from over, if any long term 'good' is to come from this war, it has yet to rear its head. The elections being held is a good thing, I will not deny that, but it is far from over and we have yet to see the outcomes of these elections.

There you go again, doom and gloom to the very bitter end. I guess nothing Bush does will ever be good enough for you, huh? You can't give him credit for anything good that he does because you are a hater. In case you didn't notice, announcements for drawdowns in Iraq have already begun. You obviously don't even watch the news. Even Wolf Blitzer and his crowd are grudgingly admitting that we are winning the war. Only radical pacifists like Murtha and Kerry and Pelosi are still pounding this "retreat and defeat" drumbeat. You really want to be on the losing side?

What's amazing is that you blindly attack Bush despite the mounting evidence that he was right, courageous, and committed to protecting America by going into Iraq, and the only reason you attack him so much is because that's what your Fib leaders in the Dem party and the MSM are doing. No other reason.

Talk about swallowing the hook.

 

[JohnnyBz00LS]

What's amazing is that you blindly attack Bush despite the mounting evidence that he was right, courageous, and committed to protecting America by going into Iraq, and the only reason you attack him so much is because that's what your Fib leaders in the Dem party and the MSM are doing. No other reason.

Talk about swallowing the hook.

:bsflag:

If BuSh was truly committed to "protecting America", why'd he get "F"s on all but one grade by the 9/11 comissioners?? Even YOU and your crapservative contingent here claim that WMDs were NOT the real reason we went to Iraq, and that it was to "spread democracy" and all that other baloney. While we've squandered our military and financial resources "spreading democracy" in another foreign country that was not a REAL IMMINENT threat to our security, BuSh and co. have let our guards down on all the other more imminent threat fronts (Iran, Syria, China, North Korea) and left our boarders wide open for infiltration by more REAL terrorists like those that attacked us on 9/11, meanwhile pusing this lame "Patriot Act" that has done little to increase security and instead is erroding our own freedoms. You crapservatives who buy this BS and continue to support this fearless loser in the oval office are nothing but hypocritical traitors.

Yeah!! Iraqi Freedom is Spreading!! WOO HOO!!!!!!!! That's really nice George, now how about paying some attention to your OWN citizens for a change, you friggin' traitor!

 

[JohnnyBz00LS]

Wow, I'm beginning so sound just like fossten.

 

[MonsterMark]

BuSh and co. have let our guards down on all the other more imminent threat fronts (Iran, Syria, China, North Korea) and left our boarders wide open for infiltration by more REAL terrorists like those that attacked us on 9/11, meanwhile pusing this lame "Patriot Act" that has done little to increase security and instead is erroding our own freedoms.

Simply pathetic.

Since September 11, 2001, NOT ONE ATTACK ON ANY UNITED STATES CITIZEN, IN THE WORLD!!!!!!!!!! [not counting Iraq.] Pretty fantastic track record if you ask me. Is getting 100% on this test an 'A' or an 'F' in your book?

 

[MonsterMark]

Wow, I'm beginning so sound just like fossten.

Um, then you're arguments would be coherent and convincing. NOT!

 

[TheDude]

There you go again, doom and gloom to the very bitter end. I guess nothing Bush does will ever be good enough for you, huh? You can't give him credit for anything good that he does because you are a hater. In case you didn't notice, announcements for drawdowns in Iraq have already begun. You obviously don't even watch the news. Even Wolf Blitzer and his crowd are grudgingly admitting that we are winning the war. Only radical pacifists like Murtha and Kerry and Pelosi are still pounding this "retreat and defeat" drumbeat. You really want to be on the losing side?

What's amazing is that you blindly attack Bush despite the mounting evidence that he was right, courageous, and committed to protecting America by going into Iraq, and the only reason you attack him so much is because that's what your Fib leaders in the Dem party and the MSM are doing. No other reason.

Talk about swallowing the hook.

I'll believe it when I see it, Bush can promise and announce anything and everything, but until it actually comes to pass, I'll have my doubt, which goes for any president. Doom, Gloom? I said that the elections were a good thing, I really should have said a GREAT thing, but that alone doesn't make Iraq a success, you call me a pessimist, I say remove the rosy colored Bush goggles you have on and see the whole picture. Bush stated in a press conference this week that 30,000+ Iraqis have died since this started and people both American & Iraqi are still dying on a DAILY basis, It's far from over.

You know, I don't generally listen to those guys, but I believe no one has said "Retreat and defeat", In fact, I think it was Johnny that corrected you in respect to Murtha when he posted Murthas actual quotes. It's somewhere in another thread.

 

[TheDude]

Simply pathetic.

Since September 11, 2001, NOT ONE ATTACK ON ANY UNITED STATES CITIZEN, IN THE WORLD!!!!!!!!!! [not counting Iraq.] Pretty fantastic track record if you ask me. Is getting 100% on this test an 'A' or an 'F' in your book?

You're definitely right there, but our borders are not secured and here's the irony, if some other POS's do pull off another attack, you'll blame everyone but Bush.

 

[fossten]

You're definitely right there, but our borders are not secured and here's the irony, if some other POS's do pull off another attack, you'll blame everyone but Bush.

So I guess Bush gets a partisan 'F' from you. What else is new.

What's the point of showing the truth to you guys? It's casting pearls before swine.

 

[MonsterMark]

but our borders are not secured and here's the irony,

The real irony is the left whines and cries about the Patriot Act and then makes comments like you did about the borders not being secure. Let me clue you in. They will NEVER EVER EVER NEVER be secure. Period. Isn't possible.

Stomping out the a-holes where they live is the best defense. The left doesn't get it. I am so frustrated I am ready for a ultra liberal to become President so we can get nuked a time or two before we surrender.

 

[TheDude]

So I guess Bush gets a partisan 'F' from you. What else is new.

What's the point of showing the truth to you guys? It's casting pearls before swine.

Did I say that? Come on now, if we do get attacked again while Bush is in office, you wouldn't hold him accountable at all. It would be someone else's fault, faulty information given, Clinton's fault etc. etc.