My lil brother,the concrete contractor says:

These LS plastic cooling systems tend to age and deteriorate as a whole. They become rotten from the inside outwards. There is signs of anywhere from small brown pitting to complete break down and crumbling apart. I myself, like plenty others around here, have at one point already replaced and rebuilt the entire cooling systems of these cars. My 01 V8 Sport was not overheating but rather producing no heat at idle and shortly thereafter lost heat completely with a leaking degas bottle. Just to add to the fun, the thermostat housing fill cap was stuck on and threatening to crack just by looking at it. I replaced pretty near 90% of that system, the JAG upgraded T stat housing, bottle, inlet pipe, DCCV and Aux flow pump. No rad and I left the lower hose alone.

The issue is not that of the type of mix you run or pressurized vs non-pressurized but more so the fact that over time the plastics begin to deteriorate due to repeated excessive heat cycling.

A little less pressure or altering the boiling point by a couple of degrees will not solve this issue.

Lincoln LS'es, that are neglected, used as daily drivers tend to see the most deteriorating of these plastics. LS'es that have been well cared for and only seen Sundays away from the garage tend to run longer on the original plastics.



Take a thought on the following;

LS#1 Sees daily routine getting to work and back, stuck in traffic jams on every hot summer day of the week, gets the same abuse in cold winter, get's used for short runs to the local convenience store, driven even harder on football night with a case of beer in the back.

LS#2 Sees only a nice calm breezy ride on Sundays to church and back, some gentle driving to the local bingo on Thursdays perhaps. Goes back in the garage for the week.



Obviously the higher mileage daily driver is going to have it's plastic coolant system deteriorate first.

It's not written in stone obviously but we tend to aim for the 10+ yr or 100K mi ... it's not long there after that it'll needs it's plastics replaced. Some can go on several more years before the issue needs addressing. The harder of a work out, the sooner it needs parts, is what I'm getting at.

We've seen all sorts of guys become new members on LVC here, they pick up a modestly used LS and it either already needs plastics overhauled or within the month they start posting about overheating and how much of a POS they think it suddenly is.

Any car after it's 10yr mark is going to need parts ... eventually, some are more prone then others but in the case of the Lincoln LS, the plastics that make up the cooling system are going to break down, it's not a matter if it will or not, more so a matter of when it will.

You can clearly see it in many of the pictures that have been posted. Look for dirty engine bays where the plastic cooling system parts are no longer black on the outsides, the one's that reflect a degrading gray to brown are the ones that will be soon be posting about no heat or an overheating issues. Hoses blowing off because the system is crumbling apart from the inside.

Then begins the ... I am still overheating, or I can't seem to bleed it properly. Nothing comes out of the purge line, now what?

This closed looped cooling system needs to be and remain air tight to properly function as design intended. Any further leaks where the system is not able to maintain or generate it's own flow pressure, it will not begin to bleed properly or even at all.

You can choose to replace just that one failing part of course, no one here is going to stop you but the experiences from others dictate that once one part goes another follows shortly there after. As I said above, it deteriorates as a whole as time passes due to excessive heat cycling. No amount of 60/40, loosen the degas bottle cap is going to fix it when it's already at the point of breaking down. Less pressure and a slightly different boiling point mixture of antifreeze is not going to reverse the plastic break down chemistry, it's just not!

It's merely a 'make-me-feel-better-for-now' bubble gum solution.


I can get a car from one side of town to the other on water w/ a loose radiator cap as well. Anyone with any brains if they try hard can do that ... does it fix, repair, replace or even remotely correct the situation at hand? You know .... the situation of the aging plastics breaking down?

on an old LS?

does it?


You believe what you will ... Listen to the Don,
he's going to help fix your tired, overheating, broken down, cooling system in as many threads as possible by the looks.



GLWR
 
Well,I understand your beliefs..........I do NOT agree with your excluding pressure as the main culprit and laying it on chemistry. There is a chemical rule,BigRig.....I am familiar with it because I am a chemical operator in a Nuclear facility for the past 27 years.
Here is the rule: When you want to increase the amount of erosion to a component you are cleaning, you step up the pressure,and you step up the heat. Now on the heat,you're right. On the pressure,you're wrong. You will not believe that some of these people that JUST purchased their LSes could go 60/40 and postpone possibly for YEARS an expensive repair.
Also, you don't want to believe that WHEN,if ever, their part fails,they will not blow their antifreeze all over their driveway,hopefully,or worse,out on the road.
I'm trying to convey to these people, that don't WANT to have to spend hundreds of dollars and down time,that there is a good way to circumvent the accelerated erosion of these pipes. SOME people will not benefit,because the buy ,like you said,a hard run used one with poor care. When parts look like KidL's, they MUST be replaced, but they don't have to be abused by 16 psi.
See my post about Evans waterless coolant. That's another out they have.
NOW! I've read all of that post above,and I HOPE you read all of mine.

To all you have been lurking,watching this argument about how to save your cooling systems OR pay out hundreds and start over new, I say THIS......like Red Green, I say,`we're all pulling for you!' At least I am. don-ohio :)^)
 
don-ohio said:
It takes savvy to tune them and keep them optimum when you're running them everyday...
Click to expand...

no it doesn't... its a carb, not magic... its as simple as adjusting a couple of screws and maybe swapping a jet or two if the engine is big enough... all you need to know is what screw does what and how to tell if your too lean or too rich... something anybody can learn in an hour or two.
 
Yer an idgit! Shows how much you know about small engines,belts,pulleys,kill switches,clutch rods,throttle cables,spark plugs,debris in carb passages,and any levers that can come loose or get stuck in the middle of a pour.
I LIVED this life from 18 yrs.old to 37 yrs.old when I turned it over to a guy who you ain't fit to shake his hand. don-ohio :)^I
 
Big, your exposition, above, is direct and to the point. I feel lucky that my '02 LS Sport had zero cooling problems until 160K miles. When I pulled the degas bottle out where I could see it I had to go over it two or three times to find the very few small cracks that, over time, let out enough coolant that when I worked the engine VERY hard, it overheated. I could have, very likely, simply replenished the coolant and driven it for several months.

I got a replacement dg bottle by luck and put it in. The engine components show no signs of imminent failure but I'm sure their life is limited. I'll be replacing the engine in the coming months and that should take care of that.

Wish me luck.

KS
 
...someone as degrading, stubborn and egocentric as yourself... I really doubt your ability to judge who's hand is worth shaking... Your a grown a$$ man, picking fights over the internet (in multiple threads) about a theory of yours on cooling systems (and others). Instead of making it with respect and merit, you use name calling and demean ANYONE you see fit. (kind of pathetic dont you think). Trust me, was guilty of it too.. I was young when starting here, and did my share of "arguing" (Mr Rig was a common issue), But you learn where it gets you... and eventually learn how dumb (or what an "idgit") you end up sounding like...

Im sure if your buddy was that great of a person, he'd say the same thing to you about judging himself over someone else...

IF your that wise of a person... act like it, if your not..move on.

(I know, who made me forum police... No one, just seeing the little shed of light in wanting to help... being lost acting like a jackoff).
 
Grell.........Yer the IDGIT! He deserved that gentle name he received.So do you! LOL! don-ohio :)^)
 
I've got 128K-mi on the cooling system and so far the only thing I've had done to it is being flushed on a maintenance schedule. On my 4th DCCV, third set of rear toe links, and third set of coils though.

Which reminds me, I'm due for another tranny and cooling system flush.
 
G-RELL said:
... and did my share of "arguing" (Mr Rig was a common issue) ...
Click to expand...

Ahh those were the days, remember when I had Hite pin you down and we made you smell my finger? Rusty hook for you ... I don't think you ever did fully recover from that one.
 
You've went thru 3 DCCVs.Kumba? What the heck was the problem? Dirt in the system or Dorman parts? don-ohio :)^)

Kumba said:
I've got 128K-mi on the cooling system and so far the only thing I've had done to it is being flushed on a maintenance schedule. On my 4th DCCV, third set of rear toe links, and third set of coils though.

Which reminds me, I'm due for another tranny and cooling system flush.
Click to expand...
 
If unpressurized is so good and prolongs the life of parts, why not depressurize the fuel system also?? It runs at a much, MUCH higher pressure.
 
So how are you going to atomize it if you don't pressurize it? When you can figure out a way to do that you will be back to downdraft carburetion.
That is apples and oranges. Coolant needs to be pressurized in high mountain areas like the Rockies.I would simply open the hood and tighten my cap in that instance.
I've run all mine thru the mountains of TENN and WV with the AC blasting,and there was no problem with the 60/40 mix and also no pressure wearing away at my parts. don-ohio :)^)
 
But after years of driving with no pressure, wouldn't your cooling system blow out the minute all those deteriorated parts were suddenly put under heavy pressure?

Have you ever thought about removing the entire exhaust from the manifolds on out? It offers many benefits from that manly race car sound to less weight, but most importantly no backpressure on the exhaust. No pressure at all, the exhaust just comes straight out of the engine.
 
No......MY plastique, pardon the pun, cooling parts would be well-rested,with NO microscopic cracks caused by years of pressure.
Yeah,if I wanted to make a terrible noise when I went on my daily drives,I might cut the exhaust out, but then that would defeat a well-tuned 280 HP set-up. Plus the Police here don't like noisy cars.LOL! don-ohio :)^)

Telco said:
But after years of driving with no pressure, wouldn't your cooling system blow out the minute all those deteriorated parts were suddenly put under heavy pressure?

Have you ever thought about removing the entire exhaust from the manifolds on out? It offers many benefits from that manly race car sound to less weight, but most importantly no backpressure on the exhaust. No pressure at all, the exhaust just comes straight out of the engine.
Click to expand...
 
your assuming that the pressure alone causes the wear on the parts, chemicals and heat cycles are the real devils.
 
No,I'm SAYING that it's like fire.......you take away one of the properties and the danger is past. Take away heat,no fire(CO2 or water extinguisher)....take away fuel,no fire......take away oxygen,no fire.
The pressure is like the oxygen being put to a slow deterioration that might not happen MUCH at all without it being the catalyst. don-ohio :)^)
 
don-ohio said:
No,I'm SAYING that it's like fire.......you take away one of the properties and the danger is past. Take away heat,no fire(CO2 or water extinguisher)....take away fuel,no fire......take away oxygen,no fire.
The pressure is like the oxygen being put to a slow deterioration that might not happen MUCH at all without it being the catalyst. don-ohio :)^)
Click to expand...

Bad analogy. The parts are still subject to the ravages of hot/cold cycles and chemicals in the coolant.
 
Okay,not the perfect analogy........ I agree to SOME extent. BUT you are forgetting that you guys have NEVER run one of these without pressure,especially for hundreds of thousands of daily driver test miles.
I HAVE run hundreds of thousands,more than a million personally,I'm sure.(I put 300,000 just on one vehicle unpressurized,my F-100 work truck,which had 100K on it when I bought it), without rotting anything,yet keeping coolant at 190 degrees and of course higher at times in the engine.
So, I have done it and you AIN'T! LOL! don-ohio :)^)
 
You know, if you drain all the coolant out of the LS, it will switch to reduced power mode and air-cool itself. That way you would NEVER have to bother with parts, coolant, pressure, hot/cold cycles, bad DCCV valves, etc.

It makes so much sense!
 
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