cammerfe
Dedicated LVC Member
If GOD had not meant us to have guns, none of us would have been born with trigger fingers. 
KS
KS
Thought For The New Year
- Thread starter cammerfe
- Start date
stlunatic
Well-Known LVC Member
i am convinced that guns and alcohol are the roots of all evil. its sad some people see these things as positives. back to your "lives" sheople!
No. Yes they can be used for evil or accentuate evil, but they surely are not the root of all evil. People kill people, not guns. Alcohol makes people ignorant of consequences, but the "evil" you speak of is inherent in people and not guns and alcohol.
stlunatic
Well-Known LVC Member
ok the root of ALL evil MAy be pushing it. i just feel that alcohol brings out the worst in people. i do drink occasionally but im not a big fan. i think its one of the ways "The Man" keeps us dumbed down. as for guns, nowadays a lot of people HAVE to carry them to protect themselves and i think thats sad. i just feel in a perfect world, these things have no place. maybe im just a little crazy
You're right but you need to understand the context. The world isn't perfect and it never will be. Taking these things away won't make anything better, people will just resort to other things. There's no invisible oppressive man who keeps us down, only our own decisions and motivation. It's much easier to manifest a scapegoat rather than to come to the realization that you are behind the wheel, regardless if you like it or not.
ground_zero298
Dedicated LVC Member
I know some mean drunks, but I know 10 times as many happy drunks.
As for guns, there just a tool like a hammer and nail. If ignorant people that are scared of guns actually went to a couple classes or shooting ranges they would have a better understanding about how safe they really are.
And guns do not kill people, cars don't kill people, knifes don't kill poeple. For someone to actually get killed by one of these, a person had to initiate the act.
If you put a loaded gun pointing at you head, and sat infront of a huge tree and waited I gaurente the gun would never go off, but the tree would eventualy fall on you, even if you sat infront of both for 100 years that gun would never randomly go off.
And the root of all evil you ask? The root of all evil is people, plain and simple. But people are also the root of all good.
As for guns, there just a tool like a hammer and nail. If ignorant people that are scared of guns actually went to a couple classes or shooting ranges they would have a better understanding about how safe they really are.
And guns do not kill people, cars don't kill people, knifes don't kill poeple. For someone to actually get killed by one of these, a person had to initiate the act.
If you put a loaded gun pointing at you head, and sat infront of a huge tree and waited I gaurente the gun would never go off, but the tree would eventualy fall on you, even if you sat infront of both for 100 years that gun would never randomly go off.
And the root of all evil you ask? The root of all evil is people, plain and simple. But people are also the root of all good.
ground_zero298
Dedicated LVC Member
LOL, before guns people had no problem mudering hundereds of thousands with sticks and swords.
cammerfe
Dedicated LVC Member
I hope it's obvious that my original comment was offered with a small touch of 'tongue-in-cheek'. However, I believe that sheeple are those who go around with their eyes firmly fixed on the ground right in front of them. They don't see the wider world---including that some people have a component of evil in their makeup. It's a fact; it is unnecessary to define, here, where it comes from. But since it exists, I choose to equip myself so as to be able to withstand its effects as they relate to me and those around me. The equipment, among other things, is most often .45 calibre, in a 1911 format.
KS
"Growing on trees?" That is the most stupid/ignorant comment I've run across in several weeks. Everything I have has come from God in one way or another. And aside from the apples in my kitchen, virtually nothing has come from a tree. How about you? KS
KS
"Growing on trees?" That is the most stupid/ignorant comment I've run across in several weeks. Everything I have has come from God in one way or another. And aside from the apples in my kitchen, virtually nothing has come from a tree. How about you? KS
ground_zero298
Dedicated LVC Member
just like saying if he meant for us to be here we would grow on trees also
fossten
Dedicated LVC Member
You would stop breathing if God didn't keep your lungs working.
cammerfe
Dedicated LVC Member
I sense a whole slew of "misunderstandings" coming on... lol I think this thread got blown way out of context. Though it is starting to become very interesting to view how other people see the world and think about things. Strangely enough, I agree with everybody to some extent. There are just so many perspectives on each situation that could make it essentially "right".
Based on religion... everything you have come to know about has come from and/or IS god... that includes evil itself... after all.. what is good if there is no evil? What is light if there is no dark?
Anyway... Yes, humans are "responsible" for "evil acts". But then when a lion kills another lion in a fight for the mate... is that evil as well? When a lion looks at 2 humans fighting and one ends up dieing... is it evil to the lion? Then again, its all about perspective.
Based on religion... everything you have come to know about has come from and/or IS god... that includes evil itself... after all.. what is good if there is no evil? What is light if there is no dark?
Anyway... Yes, humans are "responsible" for "evil acts". But then when a lion kills another lion in a fight for the mate... is that evil as well? When a lion looks at 2 humans fighting and one ends up dieing... is it evil to the lion? Then again, its all about perspective.
fossten
Dedicated LVC Member
Psalm 14:1-4
The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, and seek God.
They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one.
Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge? who eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the LORD.
Colossians 1:16-17
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
fossten
Dedicated LVC Member
God did not create evil. Evil is the absence of good, just as darkness is the absence of light and cold is the absence of heat.
Animals have no souls, and have no ability to reason - therefore, they are not a) accountable for their actions or b) in danger of hell fire.
cammerfe
Dedicated LVC Member
Inquiring minds
Hey wormworm, is that a self portrait or did someone else do it for you?
KS
Hey wormworm, is that a self portrait or did someone else do it for you?
KS
Maybe...but it has become a "teachable moment".
I wasn't talking about religion or purely religious views concerning evil. Though, as Fossten noted, evil does not come from god under most any Christian or other god-fearing religious views.
I was referring more to THE fundamental difference in visions concerning human nature and it's causal relationship with evil. From that understanding, the various worldviews, ideologies and policy prescriptions are all naturally and logically derived. It is why the two opposing visions can look at a certain circumstance or set of facts and reach vastly different conclusions as to how to confront that issue, or as to how that issue came about. It is also why there is, ultimately, no "middle ground" in policy prescriptions from the various ideologies because they stem from premises that are irreconcilably conflicting, so any policy in the political "middle ground" is counterproductive and essentially self-defeating.
You have, on the one hand, the view that humans are basically good and only corrupted by external factors; corrupt social institutions, a bad home life, poverty, drugs, violence, etc. This logically leads to things like a criminal justice system focused on "rehabilitation", policies aimed at "social justice", etc.
On the other hand you have the view that humans are inherently capable of evil and it is external factors that, from a social standpoint, tend to mitigate that evil and allow for a civil society (as opposed to a Hobbesian "state of nature"). From this view, the idea of "social justice" is a utopian fantasy and the criminal justice system is essentially wasted when it focuses on "rehabilitation".
It is from this dichotomy concerning human nature that all ideological and (ultimately) political differences are derived.
Ah, but the real problem lies in the absolute of one viewpoint or the other. Rehabilitation can work for some, but there are others that can never be rehabilitated. Some criminals arise from societal/familial situations, others are inherently evil.
cammerfe
Dedicated LVC Member
Quote---"...others are inherently evil."
When caught 'in the act', that's what lead injections are for.
KS
When caught 'in the act', that's what lead injections are for.
KS
You don't understand what I am talking about.
No one holds either of the two views in the absolute (I never said that anyone did), but the two views are inherently incompatible; there is no middle ground. To claim that the problem "lies in the absolute" of the viewpoints is to miss that fundamental point; effectively gutting the point of any substance through misdirection.
The view that "the problem lies in the absolutes of one viewpoint or the other" is just as irrational and dogmatic as that view assumes those on the extremes are being. However, when most of a population doesn't agree with your ideological point of view, it is a useful (though inherently deceptive) tactic to directly eschew all ideology while indirectly promoting your ideological views.
I know you avoid political/ideological discussions like the plague. But to force this thread to do the same; to confuse the issue, ruining any chance of a "teachable moment" and spreading ignorance and disinformation in the process, is exceedingly rude, disruptive and shameful. It is not the action of someone truly interested in understanding alternative points of view (as you have claimed is your purpose on this forum), but the actions of someone trying to insure that certain ideas are not accurately and substantively articulated.