High Output Alternator Resolution Discussion

What does the factory unit volts look like with everything kicking? Eldon asked this in his reply email.

I've never been able to get concrete answers for this since the regulator on mine is crapping out and working randomly and I didn't want to drop $190 to run voltage tests.

When I say "everything kicking" I mean it all.-full heat (with A/C so I know my fan is running) heated seats, lights, stereo, wiper defroster and rear defroster.

If I can verify that voltage holds than the HO alts "effective range" is too high.

If it drops, than maybe it's normal with that much load, I doubt it but if I cut off just one of the higher loads, I get close to the mid 13s.

So if any if you guys ( Hite, Oddball) can take 5 minutes and grab some readings, we might get a better handle on this.

Because something tells me Ohio Gen is going to be the same thing
 
Shouldn't it ALWAYS be ~14.4V? IIRC, mine was when my battery died and AAA ran a test after getting is started; with and without a load.
 
LS4me said:
Shouldn't it ALWAYS be ~14.4V? IIRC, mine was when my battery died and AAA ran a test after getting is started; with and without a load.
Click to expand...

Yes, or very close to it.
 
Broseph said:
So if any if you guys ( Hite, Oddball) can take 5 minutes and grab some readings, we might get a better handle on this.

Because something tells me Ohio Gen is going to be the same thing
Click to expand...


I dont know if mine readings would be accurate. I have converted to an electric cooling fan and it draws alot of juice. I think these readings should be taken on an LS that has the hydraulic cooling fan to get an accurated baseline.
 
LS4me said:
Shouldn't it ALWAYS be ~14.4V? IIRC, mine was when my battery died and AAA ran a test after getting is started; with and without a load.
Click to expand...

I agree that it should, but there aren't any factory alternator readings on an LS with an electric fan conversion. I suspect that those numbers would change especially with a full load, the tell-tale sign is when the voltage drops does it come back up or stay down?

My guess is with an electric fan on the stock alternator, it stays down.

No one out there with a decent-condition factory alternator and electric fan (Gen I) to get some readings?
 
oddball said:
Here are my old readings. I'll try to get some new readings (alt is 2 yrs old now).
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=70385
Click to expand...

That was with everything including the fan? You also changed the pulley, not sure how much that would change it.

If it is 13.3-13.4 at idle on the factory, it has to be the higher amp ratings on these other alts causing a low drop. That's why I'm thinking a 140 amp would probably be best suited.

Ill have to see what wrangler says tomorrow. He suggested maybe a larger crank pulley (lots of work on my part not to mention increasing the alts Rpm even more) or a second alternator (again lots of work, not to mention money and I'd just a soon by a mtorcraft for half the price of theirs and do a second alt)


II asked about a hairpin style stator which is supposedly more stable as far as power output and more durable. Its not available for the 6g case, but I was told its not impossible. It would just take time to engineer
 
I crammed lots of data into the table, so it's a bit tough to read. I had readings with the fan off and with the fan at full speed. So a worn out stock alt with small pulley fell to 13.3V with the gen2 fan at full speed. That alternator failed just a few months after that and I put in a Napa reman. Worked fine since then.

I plugged in the BatteryMole for the drive in this morning:
'02 v8, Napa reman alt with small pulley, Gen 2 elec fan.
With heater (with a/c compressor), rear defrost and lights on, it was 14.2V at 700rpm, 14.3V any other time.
I don't have heated seats.
I couldn't coerce the fan into full speed, although it should have been running ~40% due to the a/c. Maybe 10A or so?

I don't think the issue is amp rating. I still think it's primarily the regulator. Granted, we do need a certain minimum rating at idle which is always the toughest.
 
Not enough info on the page to make out just WTH that thing is doing.
I'm not certain constant voltage over 15V is a good idea for an acid battery.
 
Im not sure about that thing. I bet it would flash a CEO and give sketchy results. But if someone wants to try it I'd like to see the results.
 
Hite,

after we installed my alt. I'm getting 15v spikes after heavy loads (non system related)... They get so high they shut my amp off (assuming my amp has some sort of voltage spike protection).. Think my 650cc battery has anything to do with it?
 
Do you still have the Check Charging System message? I say buy an 750 or 850 cca battery and a reman alt from Rockauto. I have some 1/0 gauge wire we can run. Done. Then we cut those springs.....
 
girlfriendsls said:
Anybody try this idea? "if we place a 125Hz pulse width modulated (PWM) square-wave signal on the alternator gencom line of our "new" alternator, we can vary the alternator voltage setpoint by changing the duty cycle of the waveform."

http://www.p71.ca/P71interceptor.com/p71interceptor.com/alternator/mitsubishi/upgrade/
Click to expand...

That was a heck of a page load with all those pics. It's the basic idea that has been said around here in order to "trick" the PCM. Could work. My setup - thanks to oddball's fan controller - seems to be working ok. It might be worth someone's time who is looking to get power for a sound system.
 
Huzzah. That is a beefy motor controller and is way more than he needed. The packaging probably made it easy enough to use to make it worthwhile.

Someone with enough equipment and enough time could crack the problem. I've moved on to other projects, unfortunately. You'd need an oscilloscope, old alt, new alt, good info on how the new alt should be controlled, and lots of time.
 
Would a stock alt handle keeping a dual battery setup charged?

I was thinking of a decent dry cell for the audio system paired with a 200amp battery relay isolator.

I had the same sort of setup on an older box chev with a HO alternator. Never had issues with dimming lights or batteries dying, but like I said, that setup also had an HO alt.

Trying to think of ways to get around this HO issue with my GenI
 
sacsfin3st said:
Would a stock alt handle keeping a dual battery setup charged?

I was thinking of a decent dry cell for the audio system paired with a 200amp battery relay isolator.

I had the same sort of setup on an older box chev with a HO alternator. Never had issues with dimming lights or batteries dying, but like I said, that setup also had an HO alt.

Trying to think of ways to get around this HO issue with my GenI
Click to expand...

Good luck with that. The Gen 1 computer controls the alt, and if it decides the alt needs 55 amps according to what the stock car should need, that's all it gets even if the car's aux systems (like your aftermarket stereo) is calling for 100 amps. If you'd have had the Gen 2, no problems apparently because Ford decided that their PCM-controlled alternator was a poorly designed system and went back to letting the regulator control the alternator like they should have done all along. Other PCM-controlled alternators look at the system load and allow more power to be generated when it needs to be, it doesn't do it by algorithm like the Gen 1 seems to do.
 
Ohio generators is the solution, I run 3 500 jl, two 300/4, drop the money and just by the alternator instead of going crazy trying to figure it out
 
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