Xcal 2 how does it work???

we have confused this thread a little - you have to have a SCT XCAL to do any tuning on the car - period.

The question (I think) is - can a 'generic' performance tune be worth the money or it is really worth getting your car specifically dyno tuned.

I believe the answer is yes - to both.

The XCAL with the tunes that come with it have been worth the money for me - for the $400.

Dyno tuning at $150/hr to squeeze every last drop of performance out of it - well - isn't an option for power-adder guys - they really have to - but for the non-power adders - if it pick up another 5hp for $150?
 
Quik LS said:
we have confused this thread a little - you have to have a SCT XCAL to do any tuning on the car - period.

The question (I think) is - can a 'generic' performance tune be worth the money or it is really worth getting your car specifically dyno tuned.

I believe the answer is yes - to both.

The XCAL with the tunes that come with it have been worth the money for me - for the $400.

Dyno tuning at $150/hr to squeeze every last drop of performance out of it - well - isn't an option for power-adder guys - they really have to - but for the non-power adders - if it pick up another 5hp for $150?
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I agree with this.
 
StinkinLinkinLS01 said:
Here is a question I dare anyone to answer:

SPECIFICALLY, what does the Xcalibrator II do for a Lincoln LS?

And I want specifics...not just "it changes shift points, a/f ratios, rpms, etc..." I want to know exactly what it does and why it is worth $400.
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The XCal does nothing except deliver the tune to the car.

So - What does the tune do to the LS? It changes the values in the table used to determine the spark and fuel curves at certain conditions.

Just like the Hypertech, Jetchip, ...etc they are all about the same money ~$400 and all do the same thing - adjust values in a look-up tables to alter spark/fuel curves, clear DTCs, and allow minor end-user adjustments (speedo adjust, rev limiter, )....

The difference is that Hypertech develops their own tunes and sells the unit with their tune inside. SCT sells their units through dealers (tuning shops) that add they tunes to it. However - even now - SCT has a 'SF unit' that has their own tune you can buy right from them.

However - none of these companies really tell you what specific values are changed and what they are change to. It is a little bit of their 'secret' tuning that one company will claim makes them better than another.
 
StinkinLinkinLS01 said:
I've been running the max tune on my 01LSV8 for about 2 weeks now. I finally removed and have been running without the last couple days and like I've said before, the only noticeable difference I can "feel" is the stiff shifting. My car feels just as fast as it did with the tune. I know I keep going back and forth with my opinions about the XCal, but it is very difficult to "feel" power gains and I'm really not too sure about its benefits. If you have the extra $400 go for it, I like revving up past 3000rpms with my exhaust....lol...

Face it, no one knows what the hell these "tuners" do with these tunes and you can't prove it one way or the other. Personally, I think they are overpaid. My buddy says his VW gets an 80% HP increase with a chip, I'd be surprised if the xcal gave me more than 10 actual HP at most...
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When I had my LS dyno, it went from 199.74rwhp and 208.40rwtq to 216.9hp and 253.02tq.
 
do you have the dyno print-out by any chance? 16rwhp gain I asssume...pretty impressive. I would be happy with numbers like that.
 
StinkinLinkinLS01 said:
So the tune gave you almost 50lbtq? I doubt it, but I guess it is possible.
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I am just reading you what the print out says,that is max lbtq at about 4100 rpm if i read it correctly. That is right at tq-converter lock up, I will try to post the graph asap.
 
the convertor lockup is about 2300 rpm (stock) and max torque is at 4300 rpm (stock).
 
Quik LS said:
Rocket - where are you getting your information?

"Black Oak is the Motorola Power PC system that is now in use by automobile manufacturers. There have already been other Ford vehicles using it for few years like the SVT Focus, Lincoln LS, and the Navigator."

"The PCM is connected directly to the engine, transmission, and body wiring harnesses to minimize the number of leads and connectors. It regulates fuel delivery, the coil-on-plug ignition system, transmission operation, speed control, the electric fuel pump, the hydraulic cooling fan, and the thermactor air injection system.

Communication and decision-making speed is enhanced by the new Power PC 32-bit reduced instruction set chip (RISC). This microprocessor has one megabyte of read only memory (ROM).

It uses floating point arithmetic and high-level C-language modular programming consistent with standard corporate protocol (SCP) multiplex communications architecture. Input and output tasks and signal processing are handled independently of the central processing unit (CPU) to speed its operation.

Task-based versus loop-time-based programming also speeds the powertrain control computer's response. It can be flash programmed to suit whatever subsystems are installed in a particular car, including different engine and transmissions."
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When in my Advantage 2.9 software tuning the PTEC's the information stated there is that the LS computer is a PTEC computer, not the Black Oak computer.
 
You would DEFTINITLY feel 50 lbs of torque. And yeah tell me about it on dyno tuning cost. The standalone in the ranger was over 1100 just to get it up and running, than about 800 to get it tuned, still wasnt perfect but had about 400hp on tap whenever I needed it
 
StinkinLinkinLS01 said:
Here is a question I dare anyone to answer:

SPECIFICALLY, what does the Xcalibrator II do for a Lincoln LS?

And I want specifics...not just "it changes shift points, a/f ratios, rpms, etc..." I want to know exactly what it does and why it is worth $400.
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Did I not explain it for you enough in the other thread? How much more specific can I get besides drawing you a friggin diagram? Once you look at the sotware you would understand. You know what? I will open my Advantage tuning software and do a few screen shots and post them in here for you to see to give you a better idea. Your question is ludicrous and out of left field.
 
rocket5979 said:
When in my Advantage 2.9 software tuning the PTEC's the information stated there is that the LS computer is a PTEC computer, not the Black Oak computer.
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loooks like it's wrong. the LS was the first of the Black Oak PCMs.... and we paid for it by waiting years for tuners, ...etc

and no - it's not an Apple ;)
 
Quik LS said:
loooks like it's wrong. the LS was the first of the Black Oak PCMs.... and we paid for it by waiting years for tuners, ...etc

and no - it's not an Apple ;)
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Sorry, but where do YOU get your info?
 
rocket5979 said:
Your question is ludicrous and out of left field.
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He's allowed to ask the question - or state the issue - or re-open the old thread - right?

not trying to be difficult - but this is exactly what I tripped on in the other thread.
 
Quik LS said:
He's allowed to ask the question - or state the issue - or re-open the old thread - right?

not trying to be difficult - but this is exactly what I tripped on in the other thread.
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The problem I have with that question is that I answered it in an abundantly clear fashion as to what was modified in a tune. He understood it then so why the heck is he refuting it now? Boggles my mind as to why someone would have something explained in detail to them one minute and then totally deny getting any explanation the next.
 
Quik LS said:
Ford.
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Be more specific... You do know that A LOT of Ford reps and techs dont know their azz from a hole in the ground, right?

Sorry but I will trust the info from a company that is meant to know the processors and then in turn how to program them versus an overall company that is so top heavy that they dont even understand the spcifics of their own product a lot of the times.
 
rocket5979 said:
The problem I have with that question is that I answered it in an abundantly clear fashion as to what was modified in a tune. He understood it then so why the heck is he refuting it now? Boggles my mind as to why someone would have something explained in detail to them one minute and then totally deny getting any explanation the next.
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I understand and respect that.

You understand tuning - to it is hard to explain the XCal sometimes - it's not a gameboy - it's the power to modify your engine - but unless you have the understanding of those parameters (which I do not) you have to trust the results of the tune. the fact that at WOT the spark increased by 0.03 degrees and short term fuel trim bank 1 was increased by 0.07% at 3900 rpm means nothing useful to me - except that someone that understands this helped me make more (safe) power.
 
rocket5979 said:
Be more specific... You do know that A LOT of Ford reps and techs dont know their azz from a hole in the ground, right?

Sorry but I will trust the info from a company that is meant to know the processors and then in turn how to program them versus an overall company that is so top heavy that they dont even understand the spcifics of their own product a lot of the times.
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come on Rocket - give me this one at least.

Yes - we tried to work with McLaren to bring their Supercharged McLaren LS to market - but Ford would not release the BLack Oak PCM code to them (even though they had a great working relationship at the time) since they were planning to use the same PCM in the high volume vehicles - like the upcoming Mustang and F150. At the time McLaren could not afford to reverse engineer the code - so their LS concept died on the vine - it was actually sold on e-bay the the engine returned to stock and the SC in ther trunk.
 
Quik LS said:
I understand and respect that.

You understand tuning - to it is hard to explain the XCal sometimes - it's not a gameboy - it's the power to modify your engine - but unless you have the understanding of those parameters (which I do not) you have to trust the results of the tune. the fact that at WOT the spark increased by 0.03 degrees and short term fuel trim bank 1 was increased by 0.07% at 3900 rpm means nothing useful to me - except that someone that understands this helped me make more (safe) power.
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That is a great point and I will build upon that...

Just like a lot of people don't need to know the very very very specific things that are modified in a tune neither does Stinkin. But his original question was answered in its entirety which strikes me as funny now that I seen what he asked in here. It is like hearing a skipping record and trying to fix the darn record player but it still skips. I tried to explain it to Stinkin where he would understand it and I thought I accomplished that, but it would not seem so going by his post in here. Oh well, I am used to hardheaded individuals on car forums like this. :D
 
Quik LS said:
come on Rocket - give me this one at least.

Yes - we tried to work with McLaren to bring their Supercharged McLaren LS to market - but Ford would not release the BLack Oak PCM code to them (even though they had a great working relationship at the time) since they were planning to use the same PCM in the high volume vehicles - like the upcoming Mustang and F150. At the time McLaren could not afford to reverse engineer the code - so their LS concept died on the vine - it was actually sold on e-bay the the engine returned to stock and the SC in ther trunk.
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I raise you one and trade you that for the tranny thread. :D :D :D :D :D :D :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
Well - you were wrong there too... so no trade - but I dropped it

- just start saying you were wrong like the rest of us when something new comes up ;)
 
Quik LS said:
Well - you were wrong there too... so no trade - but I dropped it

- just start saying you were wrong like the rest of us when something new comes up ;)
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I was not wrong there dude. I OWN and mod a friggin 2003 Explorer! I have made over 500 horsepower with said Explorer. I know these vehicles. I dont read a book and I dont hear from a Ford hookup what they have. I know because I actually have firsthand experience with these vehicles.
 
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