Just got done watching the 1984 film called The Philadelphia Experiment. Entertaining, but total BS. Had a look around the net and couldn't find any reliable evidence proving that it really happened. Total BS in my opinion.
"You touch my junk and I'll have you arrested"
- Thread starter fossten
- Start date
Bob Hubbard
Dedicated LVC Member
You are asuming dilithium may be the only substance that could be used for this purpose,when in all proability something unknown to science at this time may very well be on the horizon.,
Not that it would hepl in the times we are living in presently.
I do think in the future, travel as we know it will not be clouded with personal body searches and pat downs, but instant transport by the process of cell degeneration,and reconfiguration, in one form or another.
Obviously I don't think I will live to see it, but the great grandchildren may very well .
Bob.
I went through one of those new scanners when I was in Vegas.
I think the whole thuggy pat down thing is on purpose to get people to go through the scanner.
The only problem is you would rematerialize dead.
A transport beam may work on physical matter some day
but I doubt a living being would live through it.
A matter /antimatter engine is the only known way so far of
compactly having the power required for extended space travel.
So far we have only been able to generate tiny amounts in a lab for less than a second.
K
Klenora
Guest
The future of transportation will incorporate the masses and ecology of modern structure. People are just breeding too darn fast and the Earth can only house so much. So the means of getting to point A from point B will make use of airways in a more sophisticated manner to include automated airbus' and flying saucers.
Allow people with a CCW to carry. You can't leave your security to someone else. Our culture has done that and it's self-destructive and leads to dependency. People with CCWs are everywhere, it's not the wild west, they aren't opening fire at Denny's. But had a few people been there with a CCW and a revolver been there on 9/11, nothing would have happened. But even if we don't take this step in liberty OR the private air carrier decides THEY don't want guns on THEIR planes...
Privatize the TSA and outsource it to companies that hire professionals with security clearance, the most likely source of these people will be ex-military or national guard.
INCREASE the use of dogs with the ability to smell explosives AND bio/chemical weapons.
Really, what is the fear?
That people are going to hijack the plane? Reality is, that won't work anymore.
The risk are still explosives, possibly a chemical attack, OR a biological exposure.
Which of these are really addressed by these security procedures.
None.
They don't even scan or inspect the cargo, that how we ended up with the printer cartridge bombs last month.
Privatize the TSA and outsource it to companies that hire professionals with security clearance, the most likely source of these people will be ex-military or national guard.
INCREASE the use of dogs with the ability to smell explosives AND bio/chemical weapons.
Really, what is the fear?
That people are going to hijack the plane? Reality is, that won't work anymore.
The risk are still explosives, possibly a chemical attack, OR a biological exposure.
Which of these are really addressed by these security procedures.
None.
They don't even scan or inspect the cargo, that how we ended up with the printer cartridge bombs last month.
cammerfe
Dedicated LVC Member
I fly all the time - I take about 20 or more flights a year...
Cal - I can tell you this - there is no way I would want people carrying guns on those flights - people get drunk, belligerent, angry, stupid... And then you add guns in the mix -
I have sat on the tarmac for hours at a time while waiting for who knows what - hot, hungry, upset, free booze because the airline is trying to do something, passengers and guns - wow - shoot out at the United Airlines corral.
Plus, how does carrying a gun always stop a suicidal terrorist? Those terrorists on 9-11 would have been armed in that case - is there a guarantee that a person with a CCW would have been able to stop them - no.
Cal - I can tell you this - there is no way I would want people carrying guns on those flights - people get drunk, belligerent, angry, stupid... And then you add guns in the mix -
I have sat on the tarmac for hours at a time while waiting for who knows what - hot, hungry, upset, free booze because the airline is trying to do something, passengers and guns - wow - shoot out at the United Airlines corral.
Plus, how does carrying a gun always stop a suicidal terrorist? Those terrorists on 9-11 would have been armed in that case - is there a guarantee that a person with a CCW would have been able to stop them - no.
Moving the goalposts, also known as raising the bar, is an informal logically fallacious argument in which evidence presented in response to a specific claim is dismissed and some other (often greater) evidence is demanded
lincolnx2
Dedicated LVC Member
I have been in a situation likek this before, the solution was simple. I statred to undress, I unbuckled my pants, and started pulling them down, thats when I was stopped. I asked what was I doing wrong, he said I could keep on my clothes, I answered I thought you wanted to see what 9 inches looked like. He turned red, and he released me. I dont really have 9 inches, but if we all travel naked, there will be no need for the TSA.
fossten
Dedicated LVC Member
There will be blood in the streets!!!!ONE!1!1!ELEVENTY!!!!
Every once in a while the mask slips and you see the statist peeking out.
Or are you just ignorant of CCW and the relevant statistics?
Or are you just speaking anecdotally, that YOU would be prone to violence in an airport? Maybe we should just not permit angry, bitter, liberal women to carry on planes.
Tell that to Flight 93. They stopped them with pots of coffee.
You really want to discuss a scenario where a terrorist tries to hijack a plane filled with carrying passengers? Go for it.
cammerfe
Dedicated LVC Member
Every once in a while the mask of experience and sweet reason slips, and the angry, frustrated liberal peeps out.
KS
Every once in a while the mask slips and you see the statist peeking out.
Or are you just ignorant of CCW and the relevant statistics?
Yep foss - be afraid, be very afraid - I happen to have one...
It took a 4 hour course. ohh... And believe me US citizen Ahmad Mohammad can get one too.... in the same amount of time. His rights are protected by the 2nd as well as mine. And if he has lived in Michigan for 6 months - and hasn't been in trouble with the law - he can get one just for asking... Or what do we do about citizens from Vermont who want to pack on the plane - there isn't a need for CCW in Vermont - they don't need a permit to conceal, and they can't get one...
You carry, the terrorists carry too... mission accomplished for terrorists - they will shoot first - they are suicidal - they are irrational... and if you are willing to shot through their hostage - they still win.
And foss - I see you haven't spent hours on the tarmac - many people are prone to violence in those situations...
cammerfe
Dedicated LVC Member
Gee, Sweets, if you're as wrong about some of this other stuff as you are about Michigan carry law---
KS (from Metro Detroit)
Maybe someone should start NRAirways or Cowboy Airlines ( Bush's motto "Bring it On!) where everyone has to be armed with a working gun or at least a big hunting knife.
The plane could be made out of Unobtainium so it could withstand and absorb gunfire and grow stronger like the hostile meteor in The Fifth Element without ricocheting the bullets.
Sharpened #2 lead pencils like the ones Nixon's ex CIA agent G Gordon Liddy described as being able to kill someone instantly by stabbing them through the neck below the ear ,will be handed out with photo instructions before boarding to those who don't have a gun.
The plane could be inscribed with "Vengence is Mine" or "Happiness is a Warm Gun" near the entrance door and next to the Terrorist Shot Dead logo where everyone could see it before boarding.
The inhouse movie could be Predator 2 (a niffty gem of a B movie), an orgasmic opera of unrestrained automatic machine gun fire, RPGs and cool sci tech weapons with a totally over the top 20 minute opening shootout.
As a bonus everybody is armed on the subway train and opens fire when the Predator creature jumps on the roof and tears his way into the cabins as the lights strobe wildly and the music plays furiously.
With my tongue firmly in cheek I can hear the cheering now....
The plane could be made out of Unobtainium so it could withstand and absorb gunfire and grow stronger like the hostile meteor in The Fifth Element without ricocheting the bullets.
Sharpened #2 lead pencils like the ones Nixon's ex CIA agent G Gordon Liddy described as being able to kill someone instantly by stabbing them through the neck below the ear ,will be handed out with photo instructions before boarding to those who don't have a gun.
The plane could be inscribed with "Vengence is Mine" or "Happiness is a Warm Gun" near the entrance door and next to the Terrorist Shot Dead logo where everyone could see it before boarding.
The inhouse movie could be Predator 2 (a niffty gem of a B movie), an orgasmic opera of unrestrained automatic machine gun fire, RPGs and cool sci tech weapons with a totally over the top 20 minute opening shootout.
As a bonus everybody is armed on the subway train and opens fire when the Predator creature jumps on the roof and tears his way into the cabins as the lights strobe wildly and the music plays furiously.
With my tongue firmly in cheek I can hear the cheering now....
K
Klenora
Guest
Meh... depends on who's playing the Predator.
fossten
Dedicated LVC Member
More proof by assertion. Yawn. And you don't understand the Vermont carry law, apparently. It only applies to carrying in Vermont. If you're leaving Vermont, it won't apply. But - setting that aside for a moment - if everybody's open carrying, there's less risk of someone being taken hostage. Simply put - you try to take me hostage, I kill you. And if your name is Muhammad - 30 armed people are keeping their eye on you. You so much as pass gas, and you'll hear slides racking.
Simple solution to preventing drunk, angry, bitter liberals from starting gunfights in airports - don't serve alcohol in airports.
I know, fox, it's hard to think of solutions when you only think in a linear, statist fashion.
Take note, everybody - foxpaws ISN'T interested in solving this problem - only in making sure the talking points that support the STATE's position of forcing us to SUBMIT are profusely propagated. She hasn't offered one solution - only tried to shoot down anybody else's ideas. That's what liberals do - complain about problems and demand the government come in and take over.
cammerfe
Dedicated LVC Member
But how comfortable are you standing before the TSA for a naked photo or to be felt up...... nevermind that.
It's illegal to drink while carrying a handgun.
Also, you're perpetuating the anti-gun myth that gun owners are just kooks who are waiting to shoot and will just start opening fire when irked or bored.
Always? Nothing prevents EVERY situation.
That's an unreasonable standard your setting when the current battery of scanning routinely fail to catch threats all the while different tactics are created to circumvent the already ineffective security.
First of all, they wouldn't.
How would they have gotten legal CCW permits and handguns.
-and it worked out well with the current system?
A bunch of foreign clowns with box cutters hijacked 3 planes and killed thousands, caused billions in damage, and rocked the nation.
To further address your strawman,
I didn't say that there should be NO security, merely that those with a LEGAL CCW should be allowed to board with their handgun and follow the law.
I know you think most people are too stupid to defend themselves, and that ONLY the political class has the ability to protect us from both the enemy and our selves, but I don't.
That's not exactly an uncommon name. Who are you talking about?
Ahamd Ajed? The one who was convicted in the 1993 Bombing?
First of all, he wasn't on any of the flights nor was he involved in the 2001 attack, so what is your point? Are you deliberately trying to misdirect?
But more importantly, no one has said that we shouldn't have airport security. A man who may meet the description of Ahmad SHOULD be stopped before boarding a plane and placed on a no-fly list.
Here's the cute part of every foxpaws "Debate" where she ceases to even address the fundamental issue and just muddies the water up.
So, in your scenario-
a U.S. citizen and terrorist has boarded the plane.
All of the ground security has given him a past. He has no terrorist affiliations or suspicious travel. He has a legal firearm and the right to carry it so he's allowed to board the plane.
His only intention is to.... stand up and shoot someone.
Why does he have to do that on an airplane?
Regardless, we'll continue with your attempt at a strawman.
He stands up and draws his firearm. He then begins to recite what his demands are....somewhere in the middle of it, a guy three rows back with a .38 snub nose shoots him in the gut, severing his spine with a hollow point bullet. He collapses to the ground, while bleeding out, unable to move, though still conscious, the :q:q:q:q in his shredded intestines leak into all of the open wounds inside his torso. He dies 12 hours later.
No one sheds a tear for him.
But let's try the even more absurd strawman you're presenting-
He stands up and forgets that terrorism is usually political in nature, forgets to explain why he's doing what he's doing or what his purpose is and he just shoots the poor bastard sitting next to him.
And then, someone shoots him.
No one boarded the cockpit.
No one crashed into a building.
A violent crime took place on an airplane, a tragedy, but contained.
Actually, that's called a stand off.
He can't go anywhere and he's out gunned.
Again, worse case scenario, there could be fatalities.
But they aren't crashing planes into downtown Manhattan or into the Capitol.
Explain to me how your FEAR is any different than a lunatic walking onto a bus, a subway train, or the mall?
This is yet another "fail" of your strawman...
..why are they stuck on the tarmac?
BECAUSE OF THE ASININE SECURITY SITUATION IN THE TERMINAL.
fossten
Dedicated LVC Member
:bowrofl: *owned*
Frogman
Dedicated LVC Member
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Extreme Shock R2LP Rounds.
Currently in use by quite a few "Air" agencies. It's what I used keep in my flight carry when I was flying armed on commercial flights.
If someone wants to carry on a plane I'm sure they wouldn't mind spending the 70 some odd dollars (retail) for a box of these if it was a condition of them carrying on a plane.
Currently in use by quite a few "Air" agencies. It's what I used keep in my flight carry when I was flying armed on commercial flights.
If someone wants to carry on a plane I'm sure they wouldn't mind spending the 70 some odd dollars (retail) for a box of these if it was a condition of them carrying on a plane.
I have seen you have never gotten the 'ssss' boarding pass Cal (often they are green - try to avoid the green ones) it makes the pat downs and scan pale by comparison...
It is also illegal to turn off the smoke detectors in the plane - it doesn't stop people.
No I am not Cal, what I am saying is that their are lots of types of people in the world - and if I am in a very closed environment, with a whole lot of strangers, and it is stressful to begin with, I really don't want to add firearms to the mix. If I am in a bar with a drunk who start to get angry because the bartender has cut him off, I can leave before the bullets start to fly - I can not on a plane.
They would have gotten permits - they aren't hard to forge. I guess the TSA could run a computer check on all the permits if it came to that - but they don't run a check to see if your driver's license is forged or not - they just glance at it...
That didn't happen during the 'current' system - 9/11 would have had to been carried out differently by the terrorists today - the box cutters probably wouldn't get through, they would have had a different plan.
And I am saying flying isn't a right - it is a privilege. If you want to avoid flying you can. If the airlines wanted you to jump up and down on one foot and sing Yankee Doodle Dandy before you boarded, they could, and you could get on the bus instead. You go through a lot to get a driver's license, and you are expected to act a certain way on the road. If you want to fly, you are expected to do certain things. Now you might think those things are unreasonable, just as many believe that speed limits are unreasonable in eastern Wyoming.
No I don't - I know lots of people who I would much rather protect me in many situations than the government - some who are on this board. However, I don't know that the stranger sitting next to me, who is getting angry and unreasonable, won't do something stupid. Now, if he is going to threaten the flight attendants with a loaded ball point pen - that is one thing - if he is going to pull out a .38 - that is something else.
Flying is stressful - and getting more so all the time. I really think the idea of adding guns to the mix isn't a solution - but is going to cause a larger problem.
You would still have security - we can't let bombs on board right (those scanners aren't there to detect handguns - they are to detect bombs). So, what have you done - you won't lessen security - and you will add to an already volatile mix.
So, KS - has Michigan added a course to their requirements, they used to be just no legal/insanity problems, get a permit state. So, how about Mississippi - they used to be an "apply and receive" sort of state.
Oh, Cal - I have been stuck on the tarmac plenty before TSA - it isn't always because they can't get you back inside because of screening.
fossten
Dedicated LVC Member
Absolute excrement. You certainly ARE pushing the FALSE 'blood in the streets' meme invented by the gun grabbersthat was proven to be a lie. Nice try, thanks for playing.
Not to mention your whole 'guarantee' straw man - the current TSA groping standards don't GUARANTEE anything either. I notice you have carefully avoided addressing that.
Just keep pushing "You Must Submit To The State." The mask slips even further.