God is Only a Theory

But then... lets take this into consideration:

Found here: http://www.gotquestions.org/Canaanite-woman-dog.html

Question: "Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog?"

Answer: In Matthew 15:21–28, Jesus encounters a Canaanite woman who begs Him to cure her daughter. Jesus initially refuses her request by saying, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs” (Matthew 15:26). Taken out of context, and especially in English, it’s easy to mistake this for an insult. In the flow of the story, however, it’s clear Jesus is creating a metaphor meant to explain the priorities of His ministry. He is also teaching an important lesson to His disciples.

Jews in Jesus’ day sometimes referred to Gentiles as “dogs.” In Greek, this word is kuon, meaning “wild cur” (Matthew 7:6; Luke 16:21; Philippians 3:2). Non-Jews were considered so unspiritual that even being in their presence could make a person ceremonially unclean (John 18:28). Much of Jesus’ ministry, however, involved turning expectations and prejudices on their heads (Matthew 11:19; John 4:9–10). According to Matthew’s narrative, Jesus left Israel and went into Tyre and Sidon, which was Gentile territory (Matthew 15:21). When the Canaanite woman approached and repeatedly asked for healing, the disciples were annoyed and asked Jesus to send her away (Matthew 15:23).

At this point, Jesus explained His current ministry in a way that both the woman and the watching disciples could understand. At that time, His duty was to the people of Israel, not to the Gentiles (Matthew 15:24). Recklessly taking His attention from Israel, in violation of His mission, would be like a father taking food from his children in order to throw it to their pets (Matthews 15:26). The exact word Jesus used here, in Greek, was kunarion, meaning “small dog” or “pet dog.” This is a completely different word from the term kuon, used to refer to unspiritual people or to an “unclean” animal.

Jesus frequently tested people to prove their intentions, often through response questions or challenges (see John 4:16–18; and 4:50–53). His response to the Canaanite woman is similar. In testing her, Jesus declined her request and explained that she had no legitimate expectation of His help. The woman, however, lived out the principle Jesus Himself taught in the parable of the persistent widow (Luke 18:1–8). Her response proved that she understood fully what Jesus was saying, yet had enough conviction to ask anyway (Matthew 15:27). Jesus acknowledged her faith—calling it “great”—and granted her request (Matthew 15:28).

So, according to both the context and language involved, Jesus wasn’t referring to the Canaanite woman as a “dog,” either directly or indirectly. He wasn’t using an epithet or racial slur but making a point about the priorities He’d been given by God. He was also testing the faith of the woman and teaching an important lesson to His disciples.
 
There is a difference in just the greek for dog and what was used at Matt chap. 15 and Mark chap. 7, 04.

The term little dogs or House dogs applies here because Jesus was being kind here. Here's some info. and remember that I was only saying that Jesus wasn't being mean-spirited by calling the woman a COMMON DOG.

"Plat. Euthyd., 298d; Xenoph.Cyrop., VIII, 4, 20; Epict.Diss., IV, 1, 111; also κυνίδιον, Euthyd., 298d; PhiloSpec. Leg., IV, 91; diminutives of κύων for the “house dog” as distinct from the “yard dog” or the “dog of the streets.”In the NT κυνάριον occurs only in the figurative saying of Jesus at Vt. 15:26; Mk. 7:27. It is debatable whether Jesus is adopting the Jewish habit of calling the person of a different Faith κύων (cf. the figurative saying at Mt. 7:6). The saying in Mt. 15:26; Mk. 7:27 brings the claims of children and house dogs into comparison. The choice of κυνάριον shows that Jesus has in mind little dogs which could be tolerated in the house [footnotes point to Rabbinic sources, b. Ket. 61a ("woman who plays with little dogs or chess"), and b.Shab., 155b on feeding little dogs]." [TDNT]

"κῠνάριον, τό, Dim. of κύων, little dog, puppy, Pl.Euthd.298d, X.Cyr.8.4.20, Theopomp.Com.90, Alc.Com.33" [Liddell, H. G., Scott, R., Jones, H. S., & McKenzie, R. (1996). A Greek-English lexicon. "With a revised supplement, 1996." (Rev. and augm. throughout) (1010). Oxford; New York: Clarendon Press; Oxford University Press.]

don-ohio :)^)
 
To 04---

Don's world view is such that he is driven to carry on as above in order to secure for himself the place outlined for 'the select few' under the JW way of looking at things. Those with an abundance of intellect can be brought to a realization that the JWs have simply CREATED everything they need to bolster their stated positions. Intellect will make one uneasy with that realization.

But others will simply spout the accepted lines. Parrot-like they alternate between offering 'hoo-ha' and jamming their fingers in their ears while chattering so as to avoid hearing anything that's contrary.

They are hanging on by their fingernails. The alternative is to acknowledge the fact that they've built their house upon the sands.

KS
 
Quote Don post #427:
"The term little dogs or House dogs applies here because Jesus was being kind here. Here's some info. and remember that I was only saying that Jesus wasn't being mean-spirited by calling the woman a COMMON DOG."

Once again Don... you just busted yourself, (unless you went back and edited posts you made.) You referred in a recent post #420 ,,, that Jesus' remarks were "tender feeling"... as to a lost puppy about gentiles. But NOW,,, as mentioned above... in post #427,,, you admit that Jesus called the woman a "common dog".

And... I never said that Jesus was being mean... by calling her a "common dog". I said that Jesus said that to her... to test her faith,,, and that she passed the test. Thus the healing of her daughter.

You tried to pull a "fast one" ,,, by manipulating Scripture... and when I called you out on the Greek,,, you now change your tune.

Nice try Don... TRY AGAIN!!!!!!!!

So now you try to pull out the Greek,,, and show that Jesus had toleration for the Gentiles??? When I already said that is what Jesus was doing with the woman??? Too late Don!!!! Try again!!!!!

Quote Don:

The saying in Mt. 15:26; Mk. 7:27 brings the claims of children and house dogs into comparison. The choice of κυνάριον shows that Jesus has in mind little dogs which could be tolerated in the house.

So Don... since you are neither a "true jew",,, nor a "transplanted Jew"... I guess that means by YOUR OWN definition of Scripture,,, that YOU are merely "tolerated" by God. There goes your being one of the 144,000!!! Hey,,, you said it... not me!!!!

However ,,, you are WRONG DON!!! In more ways than one... As CAM said in post #417:

"Jesus came to the Jews because HE had to have a place to start. His entire ministry was only about three years. But HE adjured 'go make disciples'. HE started a movement that has spread over most of the earth.........."

Wait a minute... why am I arguing this with you Don??? It seems that from many posts back,,, you never agreed that Jesus came for the Jews first... but now you are agreeing with me??? So then you make issue about a woman that is a Gentile, (Cannanite), and you try to twist that too... to say that Jesus didn't come for the Gentiles??? Is that what you are saying???

Seems that through many posts on this thread, (and another thread),,, that YOU believe that Jesus rejected the Jews... because SOME of them rejected Jesus. But NOW you are saying,,, that Jesus rejected the Gentiles... becuase they were NOT Jewish.

You really need to make your mind up Don!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Whether YOU realize it or not Don... by your own INTENTIONAL misleadings in trying to proselytize someone to YOUR religion,,, you have made du·plic·i·tous statements... that proves you are lying,,, just to save YOUR OWN A$$ !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Can I get an "AMEN" CAM???!!!
 
This gets even better people....

Near the end of post # 407... Don says this:

"Don't be fooled by anyone who teaches EVERYONE righteous goes to Heaven. The majority of righteous ones will populate the Earth along with MILLIONS upon MILLIONS of resurrected ones brought back to life on earth by Jesus."

end quote:


Now wait for it... I already got on Don's case once for this,,, let' see if i can find it???

And I found it!!!

Again... Quote Don post #301:


"and all faithful millions of the world will be. EVEN unrighteous will be resurrected and have to learn and accept obedience to Christ and his Father. MANY unrighteous,possibly billions, who have NEVER heard the Good News or had a chance at life will be resurrected."


This IS HERESY Don... as you have been taught to believe,,, along with a couple "other" denominations,,, that may not be Christian either.


So according to the posts I have mentioned above... YOU belive DON,,, that BOTH the "righteous" AND the "unrighteous"... will inherit the earth??? THAT doesn't seem to fit the teaching of Jesus in Matthew 5:5 Don. AND... I'm not going to mention again,,, all of the Bible verses that talk about what happens to the "unrighteous". YOUR belief about the "unrighteous"... calls CHRIST a liar!!!!


So once again Don,,, in an attempt to make YOURSELF seem right, (in an attempt at proselytizing someone)... you have AGAIN made a du·plic·i·tous statement,,, that has turned out to make you a liar!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


So Don... before you get diharrea of the mouth and mind,,, you might want to go back and double check what you have already said. Because at this point,,, I have caught you contradicting yourself... MULTIPLE TIMES!!!!


Told you Don,,, that you weren't going to get off easy with me. I suggest you walk away now.


CAM... can I get a second AMEN???
 
To clarify Don's beliefs... that he won't talk about:

To re-clarify:

Near the end of post # 407... Don says this:

"Don't be fooled by anyone who teaches EVERYONE righteous goes to Heaven. The majority of righteous ones will populate the Earth along with MILLIONS upon MILLIONS of resurrected ones brought back to life on earth by Jesus."

Don's beliefs,,, think that only 144,000n will go to Heaven. HOWEVER... any of over 8 MILLION Jehovah Witnesses,,,



,,,can "self proclaim" themselves as one of the 144,000... by their own belifs and teachings. This creates quite a dilemma for Jehovah Witnesses... while excluding ANYONE from Heaven,,, that isn't a Jehovah Witness. Thus their reconciliatory teaching,,, that says the rest of Humanity will be on a new earth in the future... despite whether a person has been good or bad.

I have not heard Don mention hell yet,,, in any of his ramblings. Problem is... if a person were to read the New Testament,,, they would find out that Jesus was the one that talked most about hell.

So YES DON... the venom you spew on this website,,, borders on being blasphemy!!! Better quit while you are behind Don,,, because I'm NOT going to let you off easy. If you want to get trapped in more of your lies and twisting Scripture... then stick around.

CAM... Can I get a third AMEN??????
 
My apology to all. For some reason a link I provided,,, wasn't included.

Soooo,,, between this:

"Don's beliefs,,, think that only 144,000n will go to Heaven. HOWEVER... any of over 8 MILLION Jehovah Witnesses,,, "

and this:

",,,can "self proclaim" themselves as one of the 144,000... by their own belifs and teachings. This creates quite a dilemma for Jehovah Witnesses... while excluding ANYONE from Heaven,,, that isn't a Jehovah Witness. Thus their reconciliatory teaching,,, that says the rest of Humanity will be on a new earth in the future... despite whether a person has been good or bad."

There should have been this:

https://www.google.com/webhp#q=how+many+jehovah+witnesses+in+the+world
 
WRM!!! I don't know if you are still watching or not... but MANY posts back,,, you asked for proof that Jesus actually existed. I gave you that historical proof... by several non-Biblical people that acttually existed,,, that were also historians. Now... through a very unintentionally,,, long drawn out discussion... Jesus has been quoted in the Bible many times. In some of those quotes,,, Jesus called and acknowleded himself as GOD!!! Also,,, some of the historians... noted that the Christians of early New Testament times,,, also worshipped Jesus as GOD. So WRM... after 434 posts,,, I hope I have given you SOME proof... that "God is MORE THAN just a theory!!!


Maybe???


In the end,,, it's YOUR choice WRM.
 
To paraphrase C. S. Lewis, Jesus claimed to be the Son of God. So either he was just what he claimed, or a crazy man. Without doubt he existed. But he was not just a good man. He didn't leave that as an open choice.

KS
 
144,000 KINGS and PRIESTS, chosen by God, not themselves, 04. The ones who acknowledge being of the 144,000 know the consequences of `partaking of the cup unworthily'.
Jesus was asked to seat James and John at his right hand, but he answered they didn't know what they asked. He said ONLY THE FATHER could grant this.
As far as the Earth,God's ORIGINAL PURPOSE will be realized as the resurrected millions and the great crowd of millions that survives the GREAT TRIBULATION will be brought to perfection by Jesus and the 144,000 in rulership.
`That they might not be perfect apart from us'...............remember that?
So while you HAVE no answers from the Bible as to God's original purpose for the Earth, we have discerned the meaning of Jesus'words to the one dying beside him..............`you will be with me in PARADISE'. That's the paradise Earth we know will come to be.
don-ohio :)^)
 
How many people will be populating the earth in your scenario. Can we get a count from your point of view?

KS
 
Might be as many as 15-20 BILLION resurrected. No one can say with any certainty. BUT, the righteous AND the UNRIGHTEOUS down thru time could add up. don-ohio :)^)
 
Since more than seventy percent of the earth's surface is water, you must intend that a lotta those folks'll be standing on tippy-toe or tryin' to find a log to hang on to. Doesn't sound much like paradise. :confused:

KS
 
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Cam,,,

C.S. Lewis is one of my favorites. Don't remeber in over 400 posts if I have quoted him here,,, but am pretty sure i quoted him in the "ohter thread.

One of my favorites:

“There are only two kinds of people in the end: those who say to God, "Thy will be done," and those to whom God says, in the end, "Thy will be done." All that are in Hell, choose it. Without that self-choice there could be no Hell. No soul that seriously and constantly desires joy will ever miss it. Those who seek find. Those who knock it is opened.”
― C.S. Lewis, The Great Divorce
 
Quote Don from post #437:

"144,000 KINGS and PRIESTS, chosen by God, not themselves, 04. The ones who acknowledge being of the 144,000 know the consequences of `partaking of the cup unworthily'."

Yes Don... and the 144,000 ,(if to be taken literally as you believe), are from the 12 tribes of Israel!!! Not anyone trying to earn God's acceptance by doing "works". Works never got anyone into Heaven!!!! Heaven is a gift of GOD for those who have faith!!! Your mention of `partaking of the cup unworthily' ...has to do with people that made gluttons of themselves at " remeberance feasts",,, so you are taking it out of context by applying it to the 144,000. Remember,,, it was said not to come to a "feast" hungry... that way others would have enough to eat.... and other warnings.

http://www.gotquestions.org/love-feast.html

Question: "What is a love feast?"

Answer: A love feast or agape feast was a fellowship meal eaten by Christians in the early church. There is biblical evidence for the practice of these communal meals, during which Christians gathered not just for the sake of sustenance and socializing, but for the sake of fellowship (Acts 2:46–47; 1 Corinthians 11:17–34). The term love feast appears in the Bible in the book of Jude. The author of the epistle is talking about false teachers who come into the believers’ fellowship, pretending—they are wolves in sheep’s clothing. These false teachers are described as “blemishes at your love feasts” (Jude 1:12). The ESV calls the pretenders “hidden reefs,” pointing up the dangerous nature of false teachers and their potential to shipwreck Christians.

Hippolytus of Rome and Tertullian both wrote about communal meals, though Hippolytus does not use the term agape but calls the meals simply “love feasts.” In some traditions, these meals became associated with other rituals, such as the Eucharist. It is possible that the term agape feast fell out of usage because it became associated with certain abuses that were taking place during the feasts—including gluttony and favoritism, which Paul addresses in 1 Corinthians 11:17–34. However, Christians have always practiced communal meals of various kinds. Communion, or the Lord’s Table, is an ordinance that Jesus gave the church, commanding that we partake of the bread and the cup in remembrance of Him. This was done in the early church at the love feasts (Luke 22:19). In the context of 1 Corinthians 11, it is clear that Paul equates communal meals with remembering Christ in this way, and that is one of the reasons why abusing the communal meal was so offensive (1 Corinthians 11:20–34).

Today, love feasts are still observed by the Moravians, Church of the Brethren, Old German Baptists, Dunkard Brethren, and some other denominations. In some cases, the fellowship includes a foot-washing ceremony, a meal, and the observance of communion. Some house churches have attempted to revive the practice of the love feast, though it is not always called a love feast. Sharing a meal can have spiritual significance because of the Last Supper that Jesus ate with His disciples, where He taught them to serve one another. Food brings nourishment, and wine brings gladness (Psalm 104:15; Ecclesiastes 9:7), and they can be symbols of the free gift of Christ, who is the bread of life and the giver of joy (John 6:35; Romans 14:17).
 
Quote Don post #437:

"Jesus was asked to seat James and John at his right hand, but he answered they didn't know what they asked. He said ONLY THE FATHER could grant this."

Once again Don... you quote scripture about 25% accurate,,, and then twist the rest. The part you refuse to say, (or ignore), is that Jesus tells His Apostles... that they will have to suufer like HE did. However,,,Jesus does go on to say that whomever is going to be at HIS right or left,,, has already been prepared, (by God's forknowing). This still has nothing to do with the 144,00 though... but is meant to point out that GOD already knoes who will be in Heaven.

I Know I won't be one of the 144,000... BUT I do know,,, that I will be with GOD in Heaven... and that my parents are waiting for me. Think Hebrews 11 there Don!!!
 
Quote Don post #437:

"As far as the Earth,God's ORIGINAL PURPOSE will be realized as the resurrected millions and the great crowd of millions that survives the GREAT TRIBULATION will be brought to perfection by Jesus and the 144,000 in rulership."

There you go again Don... with your "perscribed" taught beliefs,,, STRICTLY TAUGHT by the Jehovah Witnesses... but it is NOT Scriptural!!! AND the JW beliefs do not even match what Scipture says. AGAIN... the 144,000 are to be redeemed from the earth BEFORE end times,,, and they are reseved to give Praise to God.

Read Revelation 14:1-5 !!!

In order for you to be one of the 144,000 , (according to the LITERAL translation of the NWT), you would have to be a 64 year old virgin.

I don't know if you are disqualified by your experiences in life or not... but most Christian translations show that the 144,000 kept themselves UNDEFILED by the world,,, and PURE... such as a "metaphorical" virgin!!!

AND AGAIN DON,,, (for at least the THIRD time)... you need to get off the "dual class" rulership thing. THERE IS NO DUAL CLASS IN HEAVEN!!!! The 144,000 are special,,, YES... but AGAIN,,, they were set aside to praise GOD!!! NOT rule over anyone else. That is GOD's/Jesus' position. NO ONE ELSES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Quote Don post #437:

"`That they might not be perfect apart from us'...............remember that?"

I won't be one of the 144,000... and the ONLY one that can make anybody perfect... IS Jesus!!!!!!! Through HIS sacrifice on the Cross.

So WHO is the "US" you mention??? Are you quoting Scripture,,, because if you are... you had better claify the Scripture!!! Otherwise,,, by your statement... the "US" could be the 144,000,,, and it might seem like you are projecting yourself as one of the 144,000.
 
LAST quote Don post #437:

"So while you HAVE no answers from the Bible as to God's original purpose for the Earth, we have discerned the meaning of Jesus'words to the one dying beside him..............`you will be with me in PARADISE'. That's the paradise Earth we know will come to be."

Again Don... you have been taught to believe in a "paradise" earth,,, but that AGAIN... is a JW teaching. Same as with God's original purpose for earth. The thing you REFUSE to see, (because you have scales on the eyes of your mind),,, is that GOD FORKNEW... that Adam and EVE would sin. YOU REFUSE, (because you have scales on the eyes of your mind),,, to see that GOD FOREKNEW EVERYTHING... and that man would fall. YOU FAIL TO SEE, (because you have scales on the eyes of your mind),,, that God gave everyone the free will of choice to accept or reject HIM, (from CAIN on throught to present day)... and that God's purpose at the END OF EVERYTHING,,, is to resore a relationship with mankind... but ONLY for those who HAVE FAITH IN THE ONE TRUE GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Again... Jesus makes it very clear in the New Testament,,, whaty happens to those who reject God!!! I'm not going to try to explain YOUR belief in a "paradise earth",,, because it will not exist.

To re-quote part of Don in post #437:

"we have discerned the meaning of Jesus'words to the one dying beside him..............`you will be with me in PARADISE'.

Do you really think I don't know the Bible... or can't recognize SCRIPTURE,,, when you don't use chapter and verse reference???????????

This comes from Luke 23:43!!! However,,, I did a bit of INTERLINEAR study.... and have been doing that since you mentioned the INTERLINEAR in "THE OTHER THREAD".

Hey... YOU brought it up many months ago!!!

So with further study,,, the word "Paradise"... is translated to Paradeisō,,, which is ALSO found in Revelation 2:7

Revelation 2:7 N-DMS
GRK: ἐν τῷ παραδείσῳ τοῦ θεοῦ
NAS: which is in the Paradise of God.'
KJV: in the midst of the paradise of God.
INT: in the paradise of God

Now to include the complexity of the english language:

paradise Click to hear this word spoken

par·a·dise [párrə dss, párrə dz]
noun
1. place or state of perfect happiness: a place, situation, or condition in which somebody finds perfect happiness

Microsoft® Encarta® 2006. © 1993-2005 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.


SO DON... when Jesus was telling the BELIEVING theif on the cross NEXT TO HIM, (that understood that Jesus had don NO WRONG),,, that he would be in Paradise... Jesus was telling the BELIEVING theif,,, that he would be in God's Presecence/Prescience when he died.

If Paradise is THIS:

Revelation 2:7 N-DMS
GRK: ἐν τῷ παραδείσῳ τοῦ θεοῦ
NAS: which is in the Paradise of God.'
KJV: in the midst of the paradise of God.
INT: in the paradise of God

AND THIS:

paradise Click to hear this word spoken

par·a·dise [párrə dss, párrə dz]
noun
1. place or state of perfect happiness: a place, situation, or condition in which somebody finds perfect happiness

Microsoft® Encarta® 2006. © 1993-2005 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.


Then JESUS was promising the BELIEVING theif,,, that he would be in HEAVEN WITH JESUS... on the same day Jesus DIED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not saying I have the whole Bible figured out Don,,, but to accuse me of this:

""So while you HAVE no answers from the Bible as to God's original purpose for the Earth"

While you project yourself, (based on your beliefs and what you have been taught), .... as a person who has all of the answers,,, whaile many of your answers are UNSCRIPTURAL... is HERESY and BLASPHEMY!!!!

So go away Don!!! Better leave now if you aren't willing to listen to and consider what others believe. Go ahead Don,,, keep accusing others of not knowing what they are talking about... or not knowing what the Bible says, (in word). AGAIN DON... satan loves what you are doing,,, and is very happy with you trying to mislead people, (just so you think you can EARN your way into Heaven).
 
Quote Don in post #439,,, in response to Cam:

"Might be as many as 15-20 BILLION resurrected. No one can say with any certainty. BUT, the righteous AND the UNRIGHTEOUS down thru time could add up".

Don... I'll agree with the first part of your statement,,, and that "the righteous AND the UNRIGHTEOUS down thru time could add up"... But again Don,,, Jesus and The New tesatament warns what will happen to those who reject God/Jesus. So once again you speak a half-truth... while speaking intentionally vaguely. All in an attrempt to proselytize someone to your beliefs. YOU OFFER FALSE HOPE,,, WHEN JESUS TALKS ABOUT TRUE HOPE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Do you really want to continue Don??? At least this time you didn't take me full circle... so it seems you're coming up with some new material.... kinda.
 
Cam,

Don't forget that in Revelation... the new earth has no sea by John's description. Evidently,,, in the "Heavenly spiritual state", (PARADISE), we will be in... we most likely won't need water. To a degree, (from my present earthly perspective), I will miss swimming... but won't miss trying to get the water out of my ears. :)
 
The SEA is the sea of imperfect mankind. I thought you understood that,04. Figurative language here, just like the beast ascended out of the SEA.......from imperfect mankind.
don-ohio :)^)
 

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