God is Only a Theory

[04_Sport_LS]

they are stars, and galaxies. not angels.

Again... in certain places in the Bible,,, Angels ARE referred to as stars. Dig deep and understand what you despise.

it sounds more like an eclipse. sun darkening, and the moon not giving light since the sun is on the other side

I agree that the sun darkening could be a Solar eclipse, there is supposed to be one on August 21st,,, that is viewable across the whole United States.

Don't also forget a Lunar eclipse,,, also know as a "Blood moon"... which was viewable across the whole United States in fall of 2015. It was actually a "super blood moon".

There are are also Bible verses that talk about the moon turning to blood.

when you can up with something not out of the bibles little fake world and put up some compelling truth and fact, i'll rest my arguement with you, as you lead nowhere in your discussion.

And AGAIN WRM... for the 3rd time,,, you asked for proof that Jesus actually existed ... and I gave you non-Biblical,,, historical proof from what would be considered secular writings... that showed Jesus was a real living person.

Jesus claimed to be GOD in the flesh. The is why the Jewish leaders of that time wanted Jesus killed. The bible is not just a religious book... it's also a historical book!!! Many of the places mentioned in the Bible,,, exist today,,, and many of the old places mentioned in the Bible have been found by archaeologists.

SCIENCE, (which you are so fond of),,, is proving the Bible more true every day.

you just don't get that the bible can't be used to make the case for god anymore than the harry potter series is a case for witchcraft

So you don't think witchcraft or sorcery is real either huh??? I guess it's easy to deny anything you are ignorant of. I guess if you can convince yourself that none of the Bible is true,,, then none of theses things you don't understand... don't actually exist????????

maybe you can find heaven in the sky and take a picture.

That's actually not hard to do. I can get you a picture of 2 heavens. Some places in the Bible mention 3 heavens.

The first heaven,,, would be the sky... where the birds fly. The second heaven,,, would be the celestial realm... where the planets, physical stars,,, and the rest of the universe is. The third would be the spirit realm, where God and the Angels dwell, (possibly in another dimension, don't know).

when you actually come up with hard evidence in your proofs, i'll argue with you again.

AGAIN... I've already given you hard evidence through ancient records outside the Bible... and science has also proven the same through archaeology.

Seems your intense study,,, has only been about the different gods certain cultures belive in. THAT is a very narrow study... that has given you a very narrow mind and focus. It's up to you to broaden your knowledge beyond what your conclusions are,,, before you start discarding what you see as superstition.

 

[RigsLS]

what's the point in arguing , if for now we can't know for sure what awaits us when we die

Here's the real deal.

1) God is about as real as the tooth fairy and Santa combined.

2) Heavens above is something mankind made up. No such thing.

3) When it's ones time to go, it'll simply be a matter of lights out.


~ whether it be accidental or natural, you'd not even know it happened ... just last breath, fade to black ... DONE!

There is no magical bright white light you shall fallow to the delightful heavens above.
There will be no one waiting for you. You will not meet up with loved ones and you will certainly not returned in any imaginary next life as Vanna White's bicycle seat. Not going to happen!

When we die, there will be no chapter two nor any outer body experience where your soul leaves and rises to anything above. Hogwash!

We are flesh and bones. We get one shot at this life cycle. When we pass (because the heart only has so many beats), the brain shuts down, body stops operating, fluids begin to drain out, your loved ones will gather and mourn your lose, Taxman shows up, people fight over your belongings and you won't even know it is happening or had happened.

You can play on your harps, gather on Sundays and quote a book all day long if you choose to do so, no one should ever stop anyone from such personal enjoyments. No one should ever be denied the right to associate themselves with others that share such same views, nor should anyone ever be instructed to halt such practices. HOWEVER ... the reality is, we are flesh and bones, done is done. End of life cycle is just that. You died and didn't even know it.

~ true story. (I read it in a book!)

.

 

[cammerfe]

Tighty-whiteys again Rigs? Being absolutely right about what isn't... It's about like sticking your fingers in your ears, squinching your eyes shut and yelling "No, No, No, No, No...

KS

 

[RigsLS]

Hmmm, would have expected a much more mature rebuttal from you Cam, rather disturbing.

No, Tighty-whiteys are just fine, just expressing my views similar to yourself and others.

It's not my problem, reality is so hard to understand for others.
Other then a book, there are simply no facts, no nothing, just a bunch of imaginary wishing.

 

[cammerfe]

That's what faith is all about. A negative can't be proven. You simply make an assertion. We CAN agree to disagree.

KS

 

[04_Sport_LS]

We are flesh and bones. We get one shot at this life cycle. When we pass (because the heart only has so many beats), the brain shuts down, body stops operating, fluids begin to drain out,

reality is so hard to understand for others.
Other then a book, there are simply no facts, no nothing, just a bunch of imaginary wishing.

Actually Rigs... scientific study was done quite a number of years ago,,, to prove the human body has a soul that departs the body upon death.

Special beds were made,,, with scales to weigh the human body the moment a person died,,, and all precautions were taken so than no body fluids were lost,,, and every bit of weight was accounted for.

It was noticed... that AT the moment a person dies,,, there was a minute change in the bodies weight. 10th's of an ounce, (or some miniscule amount). No one could account for the miniscule weight loss scientifically,,, since all weight was accounted for otherwise.

I think a recent poster mentioned the process and/or person who tried and documented this experiment.

 

[RigsLS]

Rubbish!!!
Those that want to believe, will buy into anything. The only things that leave the body after death are fluids and gasses.

 

[04_Sport_LS]

Found it!!!

Post #583 by Ima Luthier:

"...it's not to say I'm not a believer, because I indeed am, as i have some personal experiences combined with one particular 21 grams scientific theory by Dr Duncan McDougal in 1901 that convince me."

Rubbish!!!
Those that want to believe, will buy into anything. The only things that leave the body after death are fluids and gasses.

Tell this to my sister that was a nurse for a couple decades,,, and worked in a nursing home afterwards. She KNOWS better.

As for me... it's not a matter of wanting to believe. I've had too much crap happen in my life NOT to believe... so I also KNOW better!!! I should have been dead several times in my life,,, and it isn't a matter of luck or odds that i'm still walking on this planet.

I've also seen alot of other things that can't be explained,,, other than by "Divine intervention.

 

[04_Sport_LS]

End of life cycle is just that. You died and didn't even know it.

Really? What about the multiple accounts of people dying,,, and having an "out of body experience"... watching from above,,, looking down on their own bodies as the doctors and nurses work on them,,, trying to revive them???

Eventually they wake up back in their body,,, and end up describing "to a tee" what they saw,,, and the doctors and nurses giving credit to the exact circumstances cited by the patient.

What part of them went "out of body",,, and saw their own body in the hospital bed??? How were they able to describe events that happened to them... if they were just unconscious in the hospital bed???

Humans are a 3 part being. Body, Soul, and Spirit. Body is obvious. So when theses people were dying,,, and brought back to life... which of the other parts witnessed the events,,, that the patients accurately described to those who were trying to revive them???

There is a part of us, (as humans), that is "Eternal". A never ending existence.

 

[04_Sport_LS]

I'll go a little deeper. Some of this may have been mentioned in another thread a couple years ago....

Mom died in 1990. A year beforehand... she pre-arranged and paid for her funeral. Mom also made sure that I was ok with my sister being executor of her will. It seemed odd at the time,,, considering she was mostly in good health, (at a youthful 71).

A year later around Easter Sunday... mom and I went to the cemetary,,, to put flowers on dad's grave. As we walked away to get in the car... mom said: "Well, it won't be long now". I gave her a funny look,,, but she said nothing else.

The next day,,, while I was at work... mom drove herself to the hospital,,, having a major heart attack. I called my sister, (who was 2 hours away),,, and went to the hospital. Things were "touch and go" for a few days with mom. The nurses and doctors were being supportive,,, but bracing us for reality.

All of a sudden,,, mom bounced back and recovered after a few days. At that point,,, mom was waiting to be released from the hospital the next morning. I remember that previous evening very well. I was telling mom to take some of the money she had... and enjoy life a little, (buy a new car,,, go on a cruise,,, etc.).

At that point,,, mom said she wasn't going to be needing that. I looked at her and asked what she meant by that comment. At that point my sister did too. Mom then told me I was going to be late for work... and to go.

The next morning before mom's release... My sister and I got a call from the hospital,,, saying that mom had suffered a "relapse"... and that we had better get there. Needless to say... mom ended up dyiing that next day.

So Rigs and WRM...

How did mom know to pre-arrange her funeral a year ahead of time before she died??? Why did mom make the comments she did at the cemetary,,, and the hospital??? How did mom KNOW and try to forewarn my sister and I... that she was going to die???

You can try to explain it away and make excuses for the circumstances,,, but when you live through it... there is only ONE explanation. People don't know these things,,, and do or say these things... unless GOD ACTUALLY EXISTS!!!

I've got more TRUE life experiences to talk about.

 

[RigsLS]

... I'll go a little deeper ... You can try to explain it away and make excuses for the circumstances ...

Ridiculous! You can keep on going on but it's not for me to prove there is no god, it's for you to prove to me there really is a god. With facts! This 'My sister works at an olds folks home and she KNOWS'. or 'your Mom had a feeling it was time to go soon', you can speak of others that have made claims to have had 'outer-body experiences' ... all that is just that, .... words of those that wish to believe.

... I've got more TRUE life experiences to talk about.

Not trying to get you going Bud, but all that wrapped up, does not prove that God it real. There is Birth and then there is the end of the life cycle. That's it, that's all you get. You're more then welcome to have something to believe in and hope there is something special waiting for you later on but such is merely misguidance in my opinion.

Show me God !

Not stories, sleep death measuring beds, no quotes from the book, no other reverences to others who lay claim that god is real.
Where is this magical stairway to the heavens? You can't keep on telling me this and that ... it's all just words of believing, not fact.

God is Only a Theory !!!



.

 

[RigsLS]

.... There is a part of us, (as humans), that is "Eternal". A never ending existence ...

That's like telling me Santa does in fact really slide down the chimney.
We read this in a book somewhere also. Not fact, just imagination providing a fun tale.

Show me 'Eternal life'.

 

[04_Sport_LS]

Ridiculous! You can keep on going on but it's not for me to prove there is no god,

I beg to differ. Besides a few singular comments from others,,, you and WRM seem to be the major opponents to the idea of God. Wrm and yourself say there is not God... and ask others to prove God exists.

So then... let's turn the tables a bit. I ask Wrm and yourself to prove there is no God. Use whatever means you see fit, (beyond baseless denial).

Science has proven than nothing can come from nothing. Soooo... what caused that initial "spark" that caused the "big bang",,, that set everything in the cosmos... which created the planet, microbes, animals ,,,, and humans. Basically everything we know of that exists around us today.

Even the idea of evolution wouldn't exist today,,, without some sort of beginning. I don't deny the "big bang"... but what caused it??? Especially since nothing can come from nothing. There had to be some sort of existence,,, that caused everything over the last thousands, or millions, or billions of years... that set everything into motion.

Yeah,,, ok,,, it was a few random particles... but where did thos particles come from,,, when AGAIN science has proven that nothing in this universe can come from nothing???

So yes... PROVE that God is only a theory!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You didn't get me going,,, and I'm not trying to do the same... but when contradictory ideas to the title of this thread are met with simple denial,,, there has to be proof also from the opposing side that supports the title of this thread!!!

 

[RigsLS]

You're asking me to provide proof for something that does not exist?

Sorry - but the burden falls on you to provide pure evidence that your God does in fact exist. (as you claim)

Many believers try to rationalize God's existence by saying something like this: "The existence of the universe proves God's existence. Something had to create the universe. Science has no explanation for the universe's creation. Therefore, God created it."

There is no scientific evidence indicating that God exists.
God has never left any physical evidence of his existence on earth.
The Bible is obviously the work of primitive men rather than God.
The reason why there is no empirical evidence for God is because God is imaginary.

The dictionary defines delusion as, "A false belief strongly held in spite of invalidating evidence."

Let's agree that there is no evidence showing that God exists while there should be plenty.

.

 

[cammerfe]

Holy cow, Rigs! 7:30 in the morning? You should be asleep!
A belief in God is based on faith. If you have no faith, you'll have no belief. I would never ask you to prove a negative.

I'll continue to hope you find faith. Just as one definition of a Conservative is a Liberal who just got mugged, so one definition of a believer is an unbeliever in a foxhole who's just come under fire.

KS

 

[04_Sport_LS]

You're asking me to provide proof for something that does not exist?

Sorry - but the burden falls on you to provide pure evidence that your God does in fact exist. (as you claim)

Exactly my point Rigs. Wrm starts a thread that says God doesn't exist,,, and 600+ posts later,,, I come back and ask you and Wrm to prove God doesn't exist.

You joined this argument with an issue to prove... so prove it!!! Prove God doesn't exist!!! At this point the burden doesn't fall on me!!! Especially because of the title of the thread you joined.

Sorry,,, but the burden falls on you and Wrm to prove God doesn't actually exist. People that make claims,,, need to back them up. I have done my best to prove my side. Time for Wrm and you to do the same.

If Wrm and you can't prove by evidence,,, that God doesn't exist... then maybe He does exist.

 

[RigsLS]

here you go, here's all the verbiage you need in order to validate his non-existence.

God is Imaginary - 50 simple proofs

Still at a point where you are not in a position to provide proof that GOD does exist.

Say hello to Superman and Santa for me! (also not real)

 

[shagdrum]

Rigs, not sure you appreciate the whole point of faith...

 

[shagdrum]

Many believers try to rationalize God's existence by saying something like this: "The existence of the universe proves God's existence. Something had to create the universe. Science has no explanation for the universe's creation. Therefore, God created it."
.

That REALLY is not the argument. There are numerous arguments for the existence of God that have been around for centuries and were developed by men far smarter than you or I. In many cases, the objections to misunderstand them, the concepts behind them, and the implications of them. If you are going to reject the notion of God, you need to FIRST ensure that you understand the ACTUAL arguments for God. Not simply the straw men and misunderstandings of modern Atheists.

"He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them. But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion… Nor is it enough that he should hear the opinions of adversaries from his own teachers, presented as they state them, and accompanied by what they offer as refutations. He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them… [H]e must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form." -John Stuart Mill​

 

[cammerfe]

Always glad to see you, Shag!

KS

 

[04_Sport_LS]

Ditto... and well said Shag.

 

[04_Sport_LS]

Rigs,,, I read some of the link you provided... and it doesn't actually disprove the existence of God. All that author is doing is proving misunderstandings about God,,, and twisting things to support his rhetoric.

 

[04_Sport_LS]

Oh... and Santa Claus was a real person.

Saint Nicholas - Wikipedia

 

[04_Sport_LS]

From the above Wiki link:

Saint Nicholas became the model for Santa Claus, whose modern American name comes from the Dutch Sinterklaas, itself from a series of elisions and corruptions of the transliteration of "Saint Nikolaos". When the Dutch originally came to America and established the colony of New Amsterdam, they brought the legend and traditions of Sinterklaas with them. The New Amsterdam Dutch later shortened "Sinterklaas" to "Santa Claus".

 

[RigsLS]

Rigs, not sure you appreciate the whole point of faith...

Don't need to because it's not real. Why waste my time living with the notion of perhaps I should understand faith and the bible while already understanding it's something made up by mankind and is not real.

... reject the notion of God, you need to FIRST ensure ...

rejection?
Hold on now ... something would have to be real and explained before one could reject it.
All this Mumbo Jumbo from a religious book, proves nothing other then something people buy into and live by. Not a bad gig I suppose considering it promotes mankind to go through life being good and all but it still provides no proof that the Gods really do exist. It's just written words put to paper produced by mankind.